points
10 months ago
| 2 comments
| HN
If we’re the high bit, why are changes affecting the entire community shoved through on the down-low? A moderation log and changelog announcing changes to how the site works would improve transparency and increase trust and accountability in HN. This speculation is entirely avoidable, but somehow the opaque structure of moderation on HN seems intentional. Most mod actions on HN probably fall under anti-abuse measures, and perhaps only bad actors were bothering to reply to live comments on dead posts. But seeing how hard it is to even find dead posts if you weren’t already aware of them, I’m not sure this was a problem for users, as they probably weren’t seeing them in the first place, but it could easily be a problem for HN.

I think your explanation is most likely because it assumes the least, but considering the way the guidelines have evolved, I’m willing to believe that this was being actively used by bad actors, and not simply a change that was easily justified once you saw fit to do so.

krapp
10 months ago
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FWIW, dang has commented on why HN doesn't use a public moderation log: https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
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aspenmayer
10 months ago
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A moderation log is an example of how transparency into mod actions could work. In many ways, we already have the moderation log in the form of comment replies from mods. If you used a text box wrong, mods on HN seem pretty good about replying to you if they made a mod action. Maybe not in every case, but it seems intentional and probably an effort to make their impact visible and accountable to users.

However, we don’t have any logs of moderator interventions in the functioning of the site in other ways. I’ve heard Dang say that one of my posts was downranked because it was basically a bad look for the #1 post on HN to be a post about n, where the post about n happened to be my post, and was on-topic for HN.

Edit for clarity: the interaction was over email or on HN but I don’t recall which; that is, not in literal earshot, and was direct communication to me, not indirect etc.

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krapp
10 months ago
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Like dark mode, it's probably never going to happen.
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dang
10 months ago
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brudgers
10 months ago
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once you saw fit to do so

I have no access to the code base. My supposition is based on some professional exposure to “broken window policy”, the nature of the comments in this thread, and what a rational actor might do if similar remarks were likely to under dead comments if that rational actor was motivated to create an environment fostering intellectually interesting comments.

To put it another way, I assume in the long run Hobbes is usually accurate. The sovereign’s sole responsibility is to keep the peace, and a Platonic philosopher king is the best outcome we are likely to get…which is to say that peace is kept by means most conducive to making each social contract a win-win.

But it is still a social contract. If a person doesn’t find its execution acceptable, a philosopher king allows them to leave with their health intact.

Again, I did not change the codebase.

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aspenmayer
10 months ago
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I never said you did change the codebase. I think you misinterpreted me as referring to you personally, when I meant you exclusively, because it was eminently clear from context what each of us meant, but I'm happy to clarify that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clusivity

I agree with you about the pragmatic nature of moderation under discussion, to your point.

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