Blender 5.0
313 points
2 hours ago
| 6 comments
| blender.org
| HN
gehsty
59 minutes ago
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I’d really like to see something like blender come for the 3D CAD industry, at the moment it feels like the only people who would lose out are AutoDesk. The amount of money that flows in and out of 3D cad (as subscription and then value created) having a first class open source kernel and tooling, would be giving big industrial players freedom to modify and tailor to their needs as well as smaller / hobbyists get started for free!
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jwagenet
20 minutes ago
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The problem with FreeCAD and every other free/open source MCAD project of note is the Open Cascade kernel they are built on. While Open Cascade is fairly mature, it has dealbreaker issues in a few key areas: fillets cannot consume connected faces and may fail for a number of other reasons, cylindrical and spherical faces require seams which often cause issues with boolean operations, and shapes like helixes are also often troublesome.
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bsder
8 minutes ago
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Sandia seems to have some form of kernel, but only Federal-associated entities can get access to it.

It would be interesting to see if they would license that out further for some amount of money.

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shirro
32 minutes ago
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Probably requires something that is almost there then a sponsor(s) to throw in developers or funding to get the rest of the way. On the EDA side CERN did a lot to lift Kicad to the point of being a credible alternative that could breakthrough like Blender. Both those projects are over 30 years old and for a lot of that time were dismissed as too difficult to use or lacking in features. FreeCAD is only 23 years old. I don't know what the code base is like but if a large org put a couple of good devs into it for a few years who knows.

It must be difficult when so much management is short sighted and focused on delivering short term profits for shareholders. Even academia is run like a business now.

Unless a privately held rogue company like Valve got interested its probably going to have to wait for a government/ngo/scientific. Industry, particularly the tech industry, is notorious for leaching of free and open source software and in some cases building entire businesses on it and not giving back.

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polishdude20
47 minutes ago
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Onshape has blown me away with its browser interface and how quick it all loads. And as long as your projects are public, it's free.
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SchemaLoad
13 minutes ago
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I really didn't like how they both require a phone number and make all of your files public. I've stuck with Fusion which seems a lot more privacy respecting while also being basically free for home users.
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edoceo
11 minutes ago
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Wish they had something between $0 and $1500/yr.
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1220512064
56 minutes ago
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IDK how they compare to professional CAD tools, but I've heard good things about FreeCAD and OpenSCAD. I know that some people use Blender for CAD work, and there are even some extensions to make it easier, but I'm dubious that the representation of meshes that Blender uses are well-suited for CAD applications.
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al_borland
6 minutes ago
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I just tried FreeCAD last week. I uninstalled it after about 10 minutes. The most basic actions to just get started were throwing errors. Maybe it was user error, but it was a very bad first impression.
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dgroshev
47 minutes ago
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Same, but I don't think it's possible without a large and sustained investment into a free geometric modelling kernel, which can probably be only done by a government.

Parasolid is powering practically every major CAD system. Its development started in 1986 and it's still actively developed. The amount of effort that goes into those things is immense (39 years of commercial development!) and I don't believe it can be done pro-bono in someone's spare time. What's worse, with this kind of software there is no "graceful degradation": while something like a MIP solver can be useful even if it's quite a bit slower than Gurobi, a kernel that can't model complex lofts and fillets is not particularly useful.

3D CAD is much harder than Blender and less amenable to open source development.

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LoganDark
45 minutes ago
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> Same, but I don't think it's possible without a large and sustained investment into a free geometric modelling kernel, which can probably be only done by a government.

Fornjot has been attempting this: https://www.fornjot.app

It's going to be years or decades before it's competitive though. Also, it looks like they switched to keeping progress updates private except to sponsors, which means I don't actually have any easily-accessible information about it anymore which is sad.

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dgroshev
31 minutes ago
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I'm very skeptical that one person can make a dent. Paging through the releases, they seem to focus on constructive solid geometry and code-driven shape generation, which I believe is a dead end.

The tricky bit is having a G2 (or even G3) fillet that intersects a complex shape built from surface patches and thickened, with both projected into a new sketch, and keeping the workflow sane if I go and adjust the original fillet. I hope one day we'll see a free (as in speech) kernel that can enable that, until then it's just Parasolid, sadly.

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daedrdev
56 minutes ago
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Blender is a decent option for low effort 3d modeling for 3d printing in my experience
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SchemaLoad
4 minutes ago
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Depends if your goal is artistic or functional. Blender is good if you are trying to make character models, etc. It's not great when you are trying to make a part that has to fit something in the real world and after printing you discover one step half way through needs to be 1mm shorter.
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_carbyau_
24 minutes ago
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During COVID I learnt Blender for 3D modelling. It is still my go to.

Many people complain about it being a mesh editor but it works for me. The sheer variety of tooling and flexibility in Blender is insane, and that's before you get to the world of add-ons.

I want to learn Geometry nodes and object generation as I think they will address a lot of the "parametric" crowd concerns. This v5 is meant to be a big step in ease of use of this.

Also, I'm not sure if the different tooling lets me see all the flaws of online "parametric" models, or whether I'm being pedantic. They get frustrating. I have Gordon-Ramsay-screamed "How can you fuck up a circle!".

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jwagenet
12 minutes ago
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In MCAD, “parametric” does not mean a high level part or feature is driven by editable parameters or procedurally generated features. Parametric refers to the underlying storage format representing part features in a parametric way rather than as a mesh. Mesh formats like stl cannot represent a circle by its position and radius, while a parametric format like step can. This distinction is more akin to raster (bmp) vs vector (svg) graphics. Both can be generated procedurally by “parameters”, but only with svg can sub-features be faithfully extracted or transformed.
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throttlebody
7 minutes ago
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Alibre has a free option, which does not include sheetmetal bending but otherwise solid software
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LoganDark
47 minutes ago
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I use Plasticity to model for 3D printing. Having to worry about polygons in Blender is really annoying.
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cluckindan
44 minutes ago
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So model using the NURBS tools?
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LoganDark
41 minutes ago
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Does Blender have NURBS? I don't even use NURBS in Plasticity, because curves are already essentially vectors. I don't have to worry about polygons at all, and then I choose the tolerances when I export.
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LoganDark
49 minutes ago
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Plasticity is the closest thing to this, I think. It uses Parasolid, which Blender does not, and supports xNURBS, which Blender does not.
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k1musab1
55 minutes ago
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FreeCAD is the front-runner for me.

KiCAD was also a meh ECAD FOSS alternative 7-8 years ago, now it is by far the tool of choice for regular ECAD designs. I can see FreeCad getting there by 2030.

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Workaccount2
40 minutes ago
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FreeCAD is probably the single most frustrating and unintuitive pieces of software I have ever used. I almost drafted hate mail to the devs after 15 minutes of crash coursing fusion360 got me further than 2 days of trying to use FreeCAD.

It seems like it has lots of capability but still "punch your monitor" levels of difficulty just trying to do the most basic stuff.

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foofoo12
16 minutes ago
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I use FreeCAD and it's pretty good. But I think it's impossible to learn by trial and error.

MangoJelly has done an amazing job in churning out high quality tutorials for FreeCAD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_yh_S31R9g&list=PLWuyJLVUNt...

(this is just one playlist, there's a lot more on his channel).

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RAMJAC
30 minutes ago
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While it's a pain to learn and requires some plugins (addons) for basic ergonomics, FreeCAD absolutely works for parametric CAD modeling. YMMV depending on the project and complexity, it does the trick for laser cutting, bending and 3D printing.

Deltahedra is a great YouTube channel for getting the basics.

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nickthegreek
10 minutes ago
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how long ago did you try? the recent advances have turned me into a believer as a hobbyist compared to the first time i checked it out.
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SchemaLoad
1 minute ago
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I tried it this year. Not in too much depth, but I tried Fusion and FreeCAD for the first time this year for 3D printing and found I was getting much further much faster on Fusion.

I'm sure I could grind harder and learn more and make FreeCAD work, but I'm not sure why I'd bother.

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VerifiedReports
20 minutes ago
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It suffers from too many "workbenches," some of which appear to be redundant or dated. You never know whether structures created by one are "compatible" with the M.O. of another (like "Part" vs. "Part Design").

And it presents nonsensical problems, like offering to create a sketch on the face of an object and then complaining that the sketch doesn't belong to any object. So you have to manually drag it under the object in the treeview. So gallingly DUMB.

Despite all that, I will wrestle with its ineptitude before giving Autodesk a penny. I get stuff done with it and respect those who give their time to develop it.

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Teever
39 minutes ago
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You may be interested in CAD Sketcher: https://www.cadsketcher.com/

You're on point that there's a tremendous amount of money captures by Autodesk for CAD software that could be better directed at the open source community instead.

Software like OpenSCAD and FreeCAD are obviously not suitable for much commercial work, and have very irritating limitations for hobbyist work, in my mind a big part of that is the UI and Blender has a good and established UI at this point so I'd love to see the open source CAD that provides an alternative to vendor lock in come from a Blender add-on instead of a separate program.

I am no expert but as I understand it the primary difficulty with developing good alternatives to commercial CAD software lie in the development of an effective geometric kernel.

It seems to me that if a developer of an opensource CAD program develops it as a Blender add-on they can effectively outsource the remainder of the development efforts to the Blender community while focus can be made on the CAD kernel itself.

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1220512064
1 hour ago
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I've been using blender since at least 2010; it's so exciting to see how much progress it's making.

I'm very excited to see the addition of structs and closures/higher-order functions to blender nodes! (I've also glanced at the shader compiler they're using to lower it to GLSL; neat stuff!) Not only is this practically going to be helpful, the PL researcher in me is tickled by seeing these features get added to a graphical programming language.

If you haven't heard of Blender before, or if you think AI will replace all the work done in it, fair enough. But I'd still strongly suggest looking into what it is and how it works.

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mempko
35 minutes ago
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I've used blender since 1999. It's my favorite open source software. Simply amazing
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cognitive-gl
2 minutes ago
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Awesome
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thot_experiment
1 hour ago
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Very very sad that the adaptive subdivision is touted as a Blender feature but unfortunately it's a Cycles feature.

Always nice to see these updates though, Blender has really come a long long way.

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1220512064
59 minutes ago
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It might be possible to reproduce the same effect in EEVEE using geometry nodes. I know people have done that for automatic level of detail work. That being said, IDK if subsurf as a geometry node will take a non-constant number of iterations.
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lwde
1 hour ago
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The first thing on the website is a Cloudflare Captcha box :/
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Uehreka
1 hour ago
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But after that, all the other things on the page are AWESOME! I’m super stoked about the proper HDR support and all the new node improvements.
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adgjlsfhk1
1 hour ago
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Yeah. the HDR support is very nice. ACES got their system right the 2nd time around thankfully.
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1220512064
1 hour ago
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Is this the first blender release where you can change the working color space? I thought that you could in previous versions but it caused issues with some nodes.

Now I want to look into it more, but I'd imagine that "Blackbody" and sky generation nodes might still assume a linear sRGB working space.

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Uehreka
52 minutes ago
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> Now I want to look into it more, but I'd imagine that "Blackbody" and sky generation nodes might still assume a linear sRGB working space.

Since people are always asking for “real world examples”, I have to point out this is a great place to use an agent like Claude Code or Codex. Clone the source, have your coding assistant run its /init routine to survey the codebase and get a lay of the land, then turn “thinking” to max and ask it “Do the Blackbody attribute for volumes and the sky generation nodes still expect to be working in linear sRGB? Or do they take advantage of the new ACES 2.0 support? Analyze the codebase, give examples and cite lines of code to support your conclusions.”

The best part: I’m probably wrong to assert that linear sRGB and ACES 2.0 are some sort of binary, but that’s exactly the kind of knowledge a good coding agent will have, and it will likely fold an explanation of the proper mental model into its response.

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throwaway290
59 minutes ago
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why ACES and not something like P3?
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1220512064
50 minutes ago
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Display P3 (distinct from cinema display P3, because names are hard ig) is used as a render target color space. ACES (and its internal color spaces) are designed as working spaces.

If you make a color space for a display, the intent is that you can (eventually) get a display which can display all those colors. However, given the shape of the human color gamut, you can't choose three color primaries which form a triangle which precisely contain the human color gamut. With a display color space, you want to pick primaries which live inside the gamut; else you'd be wasting your display on colors that people can't see. For a working space, you want to pick primaries which contain the entire human color gamut, including some colors people can't see (since it can be helpful when rendering to avoid clipping).

Beyond that, ACES isn't just one color space; it's several. ACEScg, for example, uses a linear transfer function, and is useful for rendering applications. A colorist would likely transform ACEScg colors into ACEScc (or something of that ilk) so that the response curves of their coloring tools are closer to what they're used it (i.e. they have a logarithmic response similar to old-fashioned analogue telecine machines).

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throwaway290
10 minutes ago
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no monitor uses ACES so it always needs to be converted to P3 to even see what you're doing right?

or you are saying if there is some intermediate transform that makes color go beyond P3 it will get clipped? then I understand...

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blitzar
1 hour ago
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Looks like they picked a bad day to do a major release.
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edflsafoiewq
1 hour ago
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That's the whole internet now. That or Anubis.
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kevin_thibedeau
1 hour ago
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Or do the rational thing and rate limit GET requests to human speeds.
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selbyk
58 minutes ago
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Based on what fingerprint?
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moron4hire
51 minutes ago
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Fingerprint: *
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donutdan4114
1 hour ago
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What’s the consensus on the future of this type of 3D tool? Especially for video animation/CGI in movies/tv/ads?

Seems like in 10 years AI will basically make it pointless to use a tool like this at least for people working on average projects.

What do folks in the industry think? What’s the long term outlook?

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simonask
1 hour ago
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If you don’t work in the industry, you have zero chance of accurately evaluating whether or not, or how, it will be impacted by any new technology.

The fact that it “seems easy” is a great flag that it probably isn’t.

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Legend2440
39 minutes ago
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Industry has no idea how they’re going to be impacted either.

Really no one can predict the future.

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NuclearPM
31 minutes ago
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Zero?
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HumanOstrich
1 hour ago
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"AI will make this pointless" is so exhausting.
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cogman10
57 minutes ago
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Directors spend a LOT of effort trying to keep continuity and that's the weakest part of AI.

What blender and other CGI software gets for free is continuity. The 3D model does not change without explicitly making it change.

Until we get AI which can regenerate the same model from one scene to the next, the use of AI in CGI will be severely limited.

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jsheard
46 minutes ago
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> Directors spend a LOT of effort trying to keep continuity and that's the weakest part of AI.

Case in point, the recent AI Coke ad was contrived to minimise the need for continuity between shots, and they still couldn't get the single element that ties it together (the truck) to behave.

https://www.reddit.com/r/regularcarreviews/comments/1oubl82/...

Not for lack of trying either, apparently they had to burn through 70,000 generated clips and manually composite the Coke logo just to get those results.

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Uehreka
38 minutes ago
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I design projections for independent theatre in Baltimore. I use AI in my workflows where it can help me and won’t compromise on the quality of what I’m making. I frequently use AI to upscale crappy footage, to interpolate frames in existing video (for artistic purposes, never with documentary archival stuff) and very occasionally to create wholesale clips in situations where video models can do what I need.

I recently used WAN to generate a looping clip of clouds moving quickly, something that’s difficult to do in CGI and impossible to capture live action. It worked out because I didn’t have specific demands other than what I just said, and I wasn’t asking for anything too obscure.

At this point, I expect the quality of local video models (the only kind I’m willing to work with professionally) to go up, but prompt adherence seems like a tough nut to crack, which makes me think it may be a while before we have prosumer models that can replace what I do in Blender.

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jamilton
1 hour ago
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If AI is at the point where it is exactly as capable of your average junior 3D professional in 10 years, it will probably have automated a ton (double digit percentage?) of current jobs such that nothing is safe. There's a lot of complexity, it's fairly long time horizon, it's very visually detailed, it's creative and subjective, and there's not a lot of easily accessible high quality training data.

It's like 2D art with more complexity and less training data. Non-AI 2D art and animation tools haven't been made irrelevant yet, and don't look like they will be soon.

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jacobgkau
1 hour ago
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As someone who's actually used Blender for small video projects, I'm fairly confident you'll still need this type of tool even with AI assistance doing some of the work in it, especially for at least the next 10 years.

AI coding agents didn't make IDEs obsolete. They just added plugins to some existing IDEs and spawned a few new ones.

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andrepd
1 hour ago
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Can there please be one post on this godforsaken website where there is no attempt to shoehorn it into the AI craze?
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bena
1 hour ago
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You build apps for Shopify.

You are asking for industry predictions from industry professionals in an industry you know nothing about while assuming a lot about that industry.

Why do you think they should do all the heavy lifting for you?

You might as well ask ChatGPT what it thinks because it seems you already have an idea of what you want the answer to be.

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Razengan
1 hour ago
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What will AI train on?
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amelius
1 hour ago
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3D scans of the real world?
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jacobgkau
1 hour ago
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I don't think the "what will it train on" argument is bullet-proof, but animation and 3D art can encompass so much more than just things that exist in the real world.
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nkrisc
28 minutes ago
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Famously, all 3D art is of things only found in the real world.
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