In a genre where spoilers are devastating, how do we talk about puzzle games?
24 points
by tobr
5 days ago
| 6 comments
| thinkygames.com
| HN
outforwilds
2 hours ago
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Outer Wilds, and imperatively its DLC, are transcendent gaming experiences.

Like many, I stopped playing my first time over a frustration with the jet pack and ship movement controls.

I returned later, this time determined to master the movement controls only to find that after mastering them you eventually abandon perfect movement for efficiency anyways and perfect gameplay looks a lot like the initial flailings.

Anytime you get 'stuck' in the game the answer is always, "what have you tried, what can you try instead?" Illuminating the tendency to presuppose an answer, and grow frustrated when it fails repeatedly.

It's certainly a "just play it without looking up anything about it" game. I went in without being spoiled by the "first surprise" that is referenced in this article and was stunned when I figured it out.

Swapping FPS violence for scientific and archaeological discovery, and a wholesome story centered on the social bonds of music make for a truly wonderful gaming experience.

I highly recommend the game to anyone.

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Terr_
32 minutes ago
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In terms of things I'd say to encourage someone to play without spoilers, I think I'd focus on mechanics, like:

1. The game has depth to its locations that shows up on repeated visits. Expect to return with better tools/information to see new things. Shortcuts will reveal themselves over time.

2. There is an in-game tool that takes notes for you, hints at undiscovered content, and can provide on-screen waypoints to help you navigate.

3. Don't be too worried about your (avatar's) personal safety, or about rushing. Later there may be times where both might matter for your goals, but the game is designed to support trial-and-error.

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ajoseps
24 minutes ago
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I’ve played the main game but never the DLC. Is it worth going back and running through again?
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outforwilds
10 minutes ago
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Yes!

Introduces what is easily my favorite planet, and a completely new story of nearly identical length.

New characters, new tools, new mechanics, new puzzles. Same feel (except narratively its a bit more spoopy). It's like a selfquel.

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humodz
21 minutes ago
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Yeah, it ties up the game perfectly
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the__alchemist
58 minutes ago
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The "first surprise" is why I tell people "Just play this game, and don't look up anything about it!".

The two games the article has pictures of games are IMO everyone who plays games should play; they are two of the best of all time.

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embedding-shape
1 hour ago
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I guess this is the one time maybe reading the comments first saved me of a spoiler I didn't want to be exposed to, so thank you :) Guess I finally need to give it a try before it get accidentally spoiled for me.
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robinhouston
1 hour ago
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> I’ve met plenty of thinky players who reject any help not contained within the game itself—I’ve been that person—but these days, with so much to play, I simply don’t have the heart to ironman a puzzle for hours and hours just to maintain a sense of pride. I’d rather see more of what a game has to offer. Sue me.

I’m not going to sue the author, obviously; but it sounds as though he enjoys puzzle games in a different way and for a different reason from me, and I find it hard to relate to his feelings about them.

If your plan is to cheat as soon as you get stuck, I can’t imagine why you would choose to play a puzzle game at all. For me, what I enjoy about puzzle games is precisely the immense satisfaction that comes from conquering a well-designed puzzle after a struggle.

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bombcar
1 hour ago
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I think this is why you have to be playing a few puzzle games "at the same time" - so when you get blocked/stuck in one, you can work on another.

I will admit that sometimes once I figure out "the trick" to the puzzle, I'll cheat and grab the solution rather than working it out by hand.

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chaps
2 hours ago
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Really glad they brought up Outer Wilds -- it's exactly the sort of game where the tiniest detail is a spoiler. Knowledge discovery's the game, so any piece of information about the game that doesn't need to be discovered is like cutting ahead to the next chapter in a game. Like playing on someone else's game file.

Wish someone would wipe my memories of that game so I can play it again.

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outforwilds
2 hours ago
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> Wish someone would wipe my memories of that game so I can play it again.

Felt the same for years, now I am doing a new playthrough.

I figured, of course I know the solution to the puzzle, but I am hard pressed to remember all the details of how I uncovered that answer, and I know that you can uncover the clues in nearly any order so I know this playthrough will be new in its own way.

And I miss the world, and the gameplay.

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alikim
2 hours ago
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I really really love both Outer Wilds and the DLC and think the reddit community, when asked, does a great job of providing advice or tips for specific situations without revealing too much.
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1qaboutecs
2 hours ago
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Has anyone played Bean and Nothingness? Great game, but also a great Discord server for this problem, with lots of norms around spoiling. I've been disappointed in some board gaming forums moving to Discord (because it's hard to search for old knowledge), but for puzzle video games it's almost ideal.
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guerrilla
2 hours ago
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Come to r/myst. I think we do alright. It's true that it's its own skill though. You have to learn to refer to things in vague terms at least.
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OkayPhysicist
45 minutes ago
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If you like Myst, try the RHEM series. Not quite as compelling a setting/story (though that's praise of Myst far more than any put down on RHEM), much, much better puzzles, with the same "Slideshow of 3D rendered environments" presentation.
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