▲Historically I've found sleepinginairports.net useful for this kind of intel—I was pleased to discover just now that it's still around! Nearly 20 years ago now it saved me from a night of awful sleep. My backpacking buddy and I had just arrived in Liverpool with an early Ryanair flight out the following morning, and no hostel reservations. We'd been traveling successfully without reservations for a bit, but it turned out there was some kind of event that weekend in Liverpool and there was absolutely nowhere to stay (or at least, nothing that cost less than, like, the budget for our entire trip).
We decided we'd just stay out late, then go to the airport and wait it out for our flight. After some effort trying to sleep on hard plastic benches in the airport Burger King (where Michael Jackson's Thriller was playing loudly on repeat, I do not know why), I pulled out my 12" PowerBook and found out via that site that the airport had a meditation room with dim lighting, soft carpet, and no Michael Jackson. Ahh.
Random events are the worst. I was driving through Bend, OR and planned to grab a hotel room but everything was completely booked. Ended up just driving up a random forest road (public land, legal to camp) and sleeping in my tent. Was walking around with my headlamp in the night and some cops came by and asked what I was up to since people are often doing drugs there. Great. They came by and woke me up during the night again and I asked them to please keep record that I'm not up to anything so I could sleep.
reply▲decimalenough2 hours ago
[-] >
My 11:30 pm connecting flight out of Los Angeles International Airport was delayed by 24 hours, forcing me to rest in the airport.If you ever find yourself in this position, just leave the airport and get a motel room. The US doesn't even have exit immigration, so it's not like they were stuck on the wrong side with a used visa.
The OP's About page notes that they're currently unemployed and living off savings, so I'll cut them some slack, although I'm not entirely sure how that's compatible with international travel from New Zealand to the US.
I also find it incredible that the airline can just delay a flight by 24 hours and offer no compensation or accommodation whatsoever, since in most of the world this would absolutely not, ahem, fly.
As I understand it, they’re only legally required to offer it in the US if the delay is caused by mechanical, staffing, or other issues in their control, but not if e.g. outgoing fights flights are grounded due to weather. They do tend to give lodging at least if you’re stuck at a layover even for weather though. But they also usually try to get out of their obligation to pay for bumping people off over booked flights by reverse auctioning with company credit.
reply▲In the US it basically comes down to, is the delay the airline's fault? If no (eg weather, ATC), then nothing. However, most US travel credit card comes with trip delay insurance which would cover the cost of an overnight stay, regardless of the reason of the delay.
reply▲It doesn’t in the US either. There’s technically no law requiring it, but every major airline provides accommodation for delays/cancellations. Unless they were doing some kind of self-transfer shenanigans with separate tickets, they should’ve gotten a hotel.
reply▲In the US, you can just get a refund if you decide not to fly (by law) or a rebooking.
Premium airlines usually offer you compensation: a meal, and a voucher for a hotel stay, depending on the cause of the delay. Very likely miles or voucher for a future flight.
If your flight is to or from EU, you are entitled to more compensation by law IIRC.
Why isn't there "capsule hotel" businesses in airports?
Is it security concerns or something about dealing with mostly non-japanese culture people?
reply▲There often are hotels, but it gets booked fast when weather causes delays. When I got stranded in Dallas in 2019, the Ramada made it excessively clear they were booked. But there's also tons of hotels around airports, you just have to get through security, and they don't do hourly billing like you might want if you weren't sure your replacement flight is also delayed.
reply▲Scoundreller2 hours ago
[-] > But there's also tons of hotels around airports, you just have to get through security
That works in USA where every international arrival has to be able to, and does, go landside.
In the more advanced world, you may only have authorization to stay in the terminal. Dunno what they do when shtf and people will be stuck for a few days.
The US system doesn’t seem less "advanced" to me. It cuts down on the number of people that connect through the US on non-US itineraries, but I don’t know that there are many US hubs agitating to become city-sized duty free malls like Dubai, Frankfurt, etc. And it makes our airport layouts much less complex.
reply▲There are almost no routes that would want to use the US as a midpoint due to geography. It's pretty much only routes to Central America that make any sense, and there's just not a lot of them.
So the US never felt the need to build airports with dedicated international zones.
In Europe, you need a transit visa, it allows you to exit the terminal. The UK border agents also can grant discretionary 48-hour visas.
Most other large transit hubs have some sort of visa-on-arrival (Turkey, Dubai, South Korea, etc).
_carbyau_37 minutes ago
[-] I've almost always seen proper hotels right outside whichever airport I'm at.
But I've never seen a capsule hotel business within the airport bounds itself despite there being many stories of people wanting to sleep at the airport.
Like most infrastructure in LA, it's always under construction and yet never improving. We lived there for about 5 years and it took them as much time to add a mile of carpool lane to the 405.
reply▲The sleepwear in First Class is by far the most bizarre thing about the whole experience.
I've never understood why First and Business Class that are so clearly mainly used by people travelling for work don't focus more on the business aspect. British Airways call it "Club" which I'm sure can only make it harder to be approved by finance. American call it "First".
In the main lounges provided by American Airlines there is often a person whose job it is to provide unlimited champagne but not a comfortable place to respond to emails.
cobolcomesback57 minutes ago
[-] I travel for work often (used to do it every week but now it’s once-ish a month), and fly business every now and then. I don’t think I’ve ever met any fellow work flyers who wanted the flying experience to be more focused on the “business aspect”. The lounge is for relaxing, and the comfortable seat on the plane is so I can sleep and not be a zombie when I land. I’ll work when I get to the destination, not while traveling.
reply▲Sleepwear: yes, weird archaic thing.
US "First class" is typically a misnomer.
I spent so much much time, money and effort abusing mileage programs between like 2009-2016. I think the the whole thing started with the oil glut following the 2008 crisis.
E.g. US Airways Dividend Miles (USDM) was a goldmine. They kept having these sales where you could buy "miles" for extremely advantageous rates. You could then redeem those "miles" in their partner airlines' flights. They were buttering themselves up to be bought by AA. This went on for years.
End result: You'd pay maybe 1400USD for a return first class ticket on e.g. Qatar Airlines between Copenhagen-Doha-Tokyo, or something similar. If you'd buy a ticket it would be 3-5x more.
comrade12343 hours ago
[-] I guess not an international flight? Normally a 24-hour delay gets you a hotel room.
reply▲If first class was full lie down from LAX it must have been transcontinental to JFK or BOS.
reply▲If you have trip insurance and your sleeping over is "an act of god", you have a high chance of qualifying for one of the in-airport bed businesses. It's been a few years so I forget the name, but an actual bed is really amazing. I can't remember what it would have cost us, but I do recall was on the very edge of what I would have considered paying myself - so worth looking at even if your layover was planned.
reply▲Has Steve Wallis stealth camped in LAX yet? Good concept for an episode.
reply▲hoistbypetard1 hour ago
[-] I think I've seen all of his stealth camp episodes, and they've only been outside airports. (Once outdoors, once in a parking lot.)
I think a lot of the humor would be lost because he couldn't get his camp stove in to cook. Or maybe he could, but would risk arrest if caught with it...
yello_downunder24 minutes ago
[-] I didn't think I'd see Steve mentioned on this site! The camp stove would probably be fine, but the fuel would be an issue. I wonder if axes are allowed in carry on?
reply▲I had a flight delayed (or cancelled, can't remember) once in LAX. They lead us to a lounge area nearby that had cabinets filled with cots. I was given a cot and a blanket and slept OK. Had no idea this was a thing.
reply▲burner4200422 hours ago
[-] There's a small airbnb outfit near the Houston airport that rents for 12 hours at a time with free ride to and from the airport. They cater to the layover crowd. It's very economical. I've not seen it elsewhere.
reply▲suriya-ganesh3 hours ago
[-] I ended up at LAX 5 am for an 8 am flight. nobody in the whole airport, no TSA nothing until 6 am.
i took a very uncomfortable nap on the floor that day.
Scoundreller2 hours ago
[-] I don’t fly enough to carry it with me, but an ultralight tent (nature hike cloud up 2 person) and inflatable sleeping bag under 2kg if you exclude the groundsheet. Not sure if security would try to wake me constantly even airside… probably yes but otherwise would sleep like a baby with my earplugs, noise cancelling headphones and eye mask
reply▲I find it ridiculous that airports in the US close. I've landed earlier than expected and you need to stare at the ceiling until 5am while other aeroplanes arrive and prepare for a race through customs.
reply▲I sometimes fly out of a small, local airport that only has one commercial route, from that airport to Philadelphia. That airport closes down overnight and it's perfectly reasonable. (And they open up at 5 AM to start serving passengers boarding the 7 AM flight; again, perfectly reasonable since there are 50 seats on that plane and you get through security in 5 minutes). But a major international airport that has incoming flights all night long? I agree, they should have at least ONE customs location staffed somewhere in the airport, any time an international flight is scheduled to arrive.
P.S. It's not just America. I flew through the Middle East once on my way to eastern Asia. The flight landed at something like 3:30 AM local time, and the security checkpoint didn't open until 4 AM or 5 AM or something like that. There were so many people waiting in line for that checkpoint, it was getting dangerously overcrowded in that hallway, with more and more people arriving down the escalator all the time. Thankfully nobody fainted or fell, but it could have been a bad situation there.
dietr1ch54 minutes ago
[-] > I sometimes fly out of a small, local airport that only has one commercial route
That one, sure, but I'm referring to a few major hubs where 10-15 aeroplanes arrive before or within the first 15 minutes after they open
Not only US. A friend’s flight was late and about to land in Munich after the airport closes. So they had to land at a different airport and then take the train to Munich.
reply▲lazyasciiart2 hours ago
[-] Sydney airport also closes overnight because it’s too loud for the surrounding residential areas.
reply▲Freaking airports are not designed for humans.
reply▲seanmcdirmid2 hours ago
[-] Changji is. And yes, its a nice shopping mall also, but also seats you can sleep on in the movie theater.
reply▲doublerabbit2 hours ago
[-] Glorified shopping malls to maul you in to insanity. Duty-free my arse.
My last trip was at xmas and I was waiting for the bus back to home. I decided to stretch my legs and went to the kids arcade. I put a quid in to a mechanical fortune teller machine which freaked on me and refused to tell me my fortune.
It ripped me off a quid and I missed the bus back home.
Your website takes me back to the days of Geocities hosting, Dreamweaver, and FrontPage 98. Nostalgia level went up.
reply▲evanjrowley3 hours ago
[-] A guide like this for South Korea's Incheon airport (ICN) be pretty valuable.
reply▲ICN is a breeze. There's actual sleep rooms that are quiet, have dim lights and have full length recliners that you can sleep on (as a bonus there's partitions between the recliners so you get some privacy). If you want something better, Walker Hill has hotels inside terminal 1 and 2 where you can get an interior room (no windows) with a bed, bathroom, etc. It's a little pricey but you can get it in 12hr increments.
reply▲It would be cool if they installed sleep pods like they have in Japan -- design it to be low maintenance and require a credit card to book with a refundable hold of a big enough deposit in case you defile it.
reply▲You sort of have to plan ahead for this now. If you’re not careful, your belongings will get pinched. If you wear an inner jacket with pockets, though, you can safely stash your goods and conk out. Even better if it’s just a reversible jacket. Luggage is harder but as long as it’s locked, you can usually just tie it to yourself and be safe enough.
reply▲The reason I don't fly anymore is because I can't stand airports. So called hostile architecture and sometimes hostile staff. This article confirms my bias. Nowhere appropriate to rest without noise, terrible lighting and hard surfaces.
My main memory of LAX was being accosted by Hare Krishnas.
I fly often and I think the airport hate is overblown.
Airports are designed to keep large groups of passengers moving as efficiently as possible, and as a result they need to make some tradeoffs. Airports aren't and shouldn't really be designed for sleeping - there's a thing called hotels for that. A lot of airports have capsule hotels paid per hour for exactly this purpose.
The root cause seems to be airlines aren't actually forced to provide enough compensation to cover a hotel. Regulation would be a much easier solution than redesigning airport to accommodate sleeping.
Only complaint I agree with is the "please do not leave your bags unattended" spam on the PA. Whoever came up with that idea deserves a couple years of solitary confinement with said PA in the cell, for increasing the danger due to alert fatigue and people completely tuning out the PA, making the channel completely worthless.
code_biologist2 hours ago
[-] Sure, but LAX is uniquely hostile. All of the other LA/OC airports are way better.
reply▲"It can hardly be a coincidence that no language on earth has ever produced the expression 'as pretty as an airport'" --Douglas Adams
reply▲> "It can hardly be a coincidence that no language on earth has ever produced the expression 'as pretty as an airport'"
I somehow got interested by quote and searched it (as is?) on duckduckgo to find a relevant reddit discussion where people were (are?) discussing trains and many other things.
Interesting quote to say the least. Here's the relevant reddit discussion
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/hqtgyg/tuesd...
IIRC, it was from his first Dirk Gently book.
reply▲>
Nowhere appropriate to rest without noise, terrible lighting and hard surfaces.Compared to every railway station I've seen, airports are 5-star resorts. Bus terminals are even worse than railway stations.
Yeah what are we comparing the airport to, home? Plenty of airports are amazing and beautiful.
reply▲This is why lounges are in such high demand. You get treated normal within their confines.
reply▲I've only been in an airport lounge once. Inside, it was more crowded and stressful than it was outside. Definitely not something I'd pay for.
reply▲In USSR (and early 90-s Russia) airports, train stations, theaters had that you'd call VIP lounges - those intended VIPs were the high Party and government bureaucrats and the likes. While general population halls were crowded those lounges would usually be empty or almost so and they would have comfortable (soft) furniture, well stocked cafe/bar, much cleaner restrooms, etc. And in many cases nobody would even guard entry and check you for whether you're a such VIP. So, i'd just go in and was never kicked out :) And while Party bozos were of no interest to me, it was interesting to mingle with top Soviet theater/movie actors at one such new theater show opening that bunch of them attended to.
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