Floppinux – An Embedded Linux on a Single Floppy, 2025 Edition
70 points
2 hours ago
| 9 comments
| krzysztofjankowski.com
| HN
sockbot
1 hour ago
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Over Christmas I tried to actually build a usable computer from the 32-bit era. Eventually I discovered that the problem isn't really the power of the computer. Computers have been powerful enough for productivity tasks for 20 years, excepting browser-based software.

The two main problems I ran into were 1) software support at the application layer, and 2) video driver support. There is a herculean effort on the part of package maintainers to build software for distros, and no one has been building 32 bit version of software for years, even if it is possible to build from source. There is only a very limited set of software you can use, even CLI software because so many things are built with 64 bit dependencies. Secondly, old video card drivers are being dropped from the kernel. This means all you have is basic VGA "safe-mode" level support, which isn't even fast enough to play an MPEG2. My final try was to install Debian 5, which was period correct and had support for my hardware, but the live CDs of the the time were not hybrid so the ISO could not boot from USB. I didn't have a burner so I finally gave up.

So I think these types of projects are fun for a proof of concept, but unfortunately are never going to give life to old computers.

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tombert
50 minutes ago
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> Computers have been powerful enough for productivity tasks for 20 years

It baffles me how usable Office 97 still. I was playing with it recently in a VM to see if it worked as well as I remembered, and it was amazing how packed with features it is considering it's nearing on thirty. There's no accounting for taste but I prefer the old Office UI to the ribbon, there's a boatload of formatting options for Word, there's 3D Word Art that hits me right in the nostalgia, Excel 97 is still very powerful and supports pretty much every feature I use regularly. It's obviously snappy on modern hardware, but I think it was snappy even in 1998.

I'm sure people can enumerate here on the newer features that have come in later editions, and I certainly do not want to diminish your experience if you find all the new stuff useful, but I was just remarkably impressed how much cool stuff was in packed into the software.

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flomo
4 minutes ago
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I think MS Word was basically feature-complete with v4.0 which ran on a 1MB 68000 Macintosh. Obviously they have added lots of UI and geegaws, but the core word processing functionality hasn't really changed at all.
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mikepurvis
28 minutes ago
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It's crazy too to realise how much of the multi-application interop vision was realized in Office 97 too. Visual Basic for Applications had rich hooks into all the apps, you could make macros and scripts and embed them into documents, you could embed documents into each other.

It's really astonishing how full-featured it all was, and it was running on those Pentium machines that had a "turbo" button to switch between 33 and 66 MHz and just a few MBs of RAM.

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justapassenger
11 minutes ago
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Last true step change in computer performance for general home computing tasks was SSD.
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endgame
32 minutes ago
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You might have some luck applying isohybrid(1) to the period-correct .iso image, making it bootable by other means: https://manpages.debian.org/stretch/syslinux-utils/isohybrid...
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1313ed01
39 minutes ago
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NetBSD is probably what would make most sense to run on that old hardware.

Alternatively you may have accidently built a great machine for installing FreeDOS to run old DOS games/applications. It does install from USB, but needs BIOS so can't run it on modern PC hardware.

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Fiveplus
1 hour ago
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The persistence strategy described here (mount -t msdos -o rw /dev/fd0 /mnt) combined with a bind mount to home is a nice clever touch for saving space.

I don't know if that's also true for data integrity on physical magnetic media. FAT12 is not a journaling filesystem. On a modern drive, a crash during a write is at best, annoying while on a 3.5" floppy with a 33mhz CPU, a write operation blocks for a perceptible amount of time. If the user hits the power switch or the kernel panics while the heads are moving or the FAT is updating, that disk is gone. The article mentions sync, but sync on a floppy drive is an agonizingly slow operation that users might interrupt.

Given the 253KiB free space constraint, I wonder if a better approach would be treating the free space as a raw block device or a tiny appended partition using a log-structured filesystem designed for slow media (like a stripped down JFFS2 or something), though that might require too many kernel modules.

Has anyone out there experimented with appending a tar archive to the end of the initramfs image inplace for persistence, rather than mounting the raw FAT filesystem? It might be safer to serialize writes only on shutdown, would love more thoughts on this.

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userbinator
1 hour ago
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Controversial position: journaling is not as beneficial as commonly believed. I have been using FAT for decades and never encountered much in the way of data corruption. It's probably found in far more embedded devices than PCs these days.
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Skunkleton
44 minutes ago
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If you make structural changes to your filesystem without a journal, and you fail mid way, there is a 100% chance your filesystem is not in a known state, and a very good chance it is in a non-self-consistent state that will lead to some interesting surprises down the line.
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userbinator
18 minutes ago
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No, it is very well known what will happen: you can get lost cluster chains, which are easily cleaned up. As long as the order of writes is known, there is no problem.
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ars
23 minutes ago
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FAT has two allocation tables, the main one and a backup. So if you shut it off while manipulating the first one you have the backup. You are expected to run a filesystem check after a power failure.
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zx8080
1 hour ago
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> If the user hits the power switch or the kernel panics while the heads are moving or the FAT is updating, that disk is gone.

Makes sense, great point. I would rather use a second drive for the write disk space, if possible (I know how rare it's now to have two floppy drives, but still).

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ars
22 minutes ago
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> If the user hits the power switch or the kernel panics while the heads are moving or the FAT is updating, that disk is gone.

This isn't true, I commented lower in the thread, but FAT keeps a backup table, and you can use that to restore the disk.

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hilti
2 hours ago
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I remember the QNX Demo on a 1.44 MB floppy disk. It booted straight into a full blown window manager and had a basic web browser. That was 1999 and I never saw anything like that afterwards.
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userbinator
1 hour ago
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MenuetOS/KolibriOS:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38059961

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27249075

That was 1999 and I never saw anything like that afterwards.

Now you have ;-)

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hilti
48 minutes ago
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Wow! I never heard of them. KolibriOS looks promising.
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xkriva11
34 minutes ago
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throwup238
1 hour ago
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Would that even fit the unicode tables today?
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heinternets
2 hours ago
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I miss the floppy disk sound and the anticipation then joy of finally loading into the OS.
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jdub
1 hour ago
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> After 5 minutes I got freshly burned floppy.

oh god

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userbinator
1 hour ago
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That is an indication of someone who grew up in the CD-R/RW era.
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6LLvveMx2koXfwn
2 hours ago
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Did I misremember downloading Slackware to 12 floppies in 1997?
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gattilorenz
15 minutes ago
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MuLinux was also a floppy-based “live” distro, with optional floppy disks for X11, programming languages, etc.
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stackghost
41 minutes ago
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Probably not. Pretty sure it was Puppy Linux (among I'm sure others) that could be run on just two floppies. I used to have this old 933MHz Coppermine system that I took when a medical office was going to throw it out, some time in the early 00s.

The HDD was borked but it had a 3.5" bay that worked, so I got a floppy-based distro running on it. I later replaced the drive and then made the mistake of attempting to compile X11 on it. Results were... mixed.

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yjftsjthsd-h
1 hour ago
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I thought Linux dropped driver support for real floppy drives. Did that not happen, or am I missing something?
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madduci
1 hour ago
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No but I find this line interesting:

The Linux kernel drops i486 support in 6.15 (released May 2025), so 6.14 (released March 2025) is the latest version with full compatibility.

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zx8080
1 hour ago
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Any chance of backporting changes to be able to run on older hardware?
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yjftsjthsd-h
1 hour ago
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https://kernel.org/ says 6.12 is still a supported LTS, so you could just run that.
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creatonez
1 hour ago
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Don't think so? Linux should still support almost all builtin motherboard floppy controllers, for the platforms it still runs on. ISA floppy controller support is probably not as comprehensive, but not because anything has been dropped.
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yjftsjthsd-h
1 hour ago
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Huh, yeah looks like I misremembered.
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ggm
2 hours ago
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mgr on sun hardware probably could have come close
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hn_throwaway_99
2 hours ago
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What's a floppy?
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mrbluecoat
1 hour ago
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Floppy is a race of robotic jackalopes, known for their floppy ears. A "Single Floppy" is a rare subset of that species where only one ear flops down due to a random mutation of their hardware.
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