Asahi Linux Progress Report: Linux 6.19
139 points
3 hours ago
| 8 comments
| asahilinux.org
| HN
burner420042
8 minutes ago
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I was watching Bladerunner last night, specifically the part where Ford is zooming in on the photograph using voice commands.

Above the display is an amber horizontal bar that changes in sync with the activity on the display and my first thought was, "Finally they found a use for the Mac Touch Bar!"

The Touch Bar has so many uses in Linux I can't wait for it to work.

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api
5 minutes ago
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Yeah it could have been useful but I feel like they nerfed it from the start. Still wasn’t a big fan.

I was hoping it was a tease for a fully software defined haptic feedback based keyboard. There’s the obvious usefulness and coolness of that, and then the fact that you could make a laptop closer to the sealed clean-ability of a phone. Probably not quite submersible/waterproof due to ports and fans but able to survive a spill and be cleaned well.

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signa11
56 minutes ago
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the money quote (at least for some)

    In fact, the current state of M3 support is about where M1 support was when we released the first Arch
    Linux ARM based beta; keyboard, touchpad, WiFi, NVMe and USB3 are all working, albeit with some local 
    patches to m1n1 and the Asahi kernel (yet to make their way into a pull request) required. So that 
    must mean we will have a release ready soon, right?
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gr4vityWall
2 hours ago
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Great work. I believe used M1/M2 machines will be favored by young developers as their personal fun laptop in a few years, like the Thinkpad T420 used to be. For different reasons, of course.

Do the M4 and M5 GPUs also change a lot from the M3? I hope it's not too much work to get those going once M3 is usable.

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haunter
32 minutes ago
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I just like the build quality and they are reaching the 200€ threshold on the used market. I bought one with 16GB RAM and a small black strip one the side of the screen (don’t bother me) for 230€ last week
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zozbot234
1 hour ago
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Public information seems to describe the M4 GPU as mostly a performance-oriented refresh of the one from M3. M5 has brought bigger changes, not least neural/tensor accelerators on chip.
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sohrob
2 hours ago
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I often wonder whether the folks at Apple have the Asahi team on their radar. Are they in awe of the reverse engineering marvels coming out of the Asahi project, or are they indifferent to it?
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Bigpet
1 hour ago
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I think the dev that was responsible for the bootloader or some security chip having the option to be opened posted on twitter a while ago. Pretty sure he implied or mentioned that this was what he was hoping for.

Edit: this was what I was remembering: https://x.com/XenoKovah/status/1339914714055368704

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worldsavior
46 minutes ago
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I don't think they care. It brings more customers to Apple.
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chippiewill
21 minutes ago
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IIRC Marcan mentioned something he found that had been deliberately put into the Mac boot loader that made booting alternative operating systems easier and perhaps making it possible altogether.
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jsheard
17 minutes ago
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That's apparent enough from the fact that you don't need a jailbreak exploit to boot non-Apple-signed kernels on a Mac, unlike iPads with exactly the same silicon. They are intentionally configured differently.
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imglorp
9 minutes ago
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Why the locking difference on platforms?

I so want to run my os on ipad and save it from the ewaste bin.

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Kenji
1 hour ago
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Certainly they know about it. There is no way they don't.
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lame-robot-hoax
57 minutes ago
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Man, I know it’s probably going to be a while longer, but I’m really looking forward to the day I can run Asahi on my M4 Air.
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ForHackernews
1 hour ago
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This is incredibly impressive and also quite sad. Six years later, we have a very-nearly-right kernel for the M1.

Apple is launching the M5. It seems like the future is going to be a world of closed systems and custom silicon, with any free software lagging far behind.

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zozbot234
1 hour ago
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M1 and M2 hardware isn't going anywhere. They're still great machines. And progress will be faster once the project finishes getting their code merged into the existing Linux kernel and distros. They have a first alpha of M3 ready, they're just refraining from releasing it in that state because they're so busy with everything else they're doing - a key difference compared to when they first came out with alpha support for the M1.
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joleyj
1 hour ago
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Most of my software development career was spent working at a small company that sold a product that emulated the operating system developed and sold by a much, much larger company. The work was interesting and when you had a breakthrough or a small victory, it sure felt good. The challenge of keeping up was exhilarating and kept folks motivated to keep pressing forward.

But eventually it wears you down. It's nearly impossible to keep up in the long-term. Normal product evolution, the sheer size of the behemoth and sometimes even malice on their part to thwart the little guy make it really tough to stay current.

Think of Wine vis-a-vis Windows. They will never catch up.

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qdotme
58 minutes ago
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Except they did with Wine, in a way. They got to the point where sufficient number of third party software developers target the common base between Wine and Windows (Steam/Proton), electing to have broader compatibility rather than catching all the newest Windows-only APIs.

I wonder how much similar behavior influence other buying choices. I’ve been eyeing an upgrade from M1 for a while - so far punting on it, mostly because of Asahi.

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joleyj
50 minutes ago
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I guess I wasn't aware that Wine pivoted from trying to be a general purpose, drop-in replacement for Windows to being a platform for games that only supports a subset of Windows functionality.

It's much more difficult to keep current and support the full functionality of a much larger competitor's offering when you have to support everything. In my experience it was an all or nothing proposition. Either you emulated it 100% or you had nothing. I think Asahi is more in this realm maybe than Wine. It really needs to support all the hardware, 100%, or it's value is greatly diminished.

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lonjil
42 seconds ago
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> I guess I wasn't aware that Wine pivoted from trying to be a general purpose, drop-in replacement for Windows to being a platform for games that only supports a subset of Windows functionality.

It didn't.

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madduci
1 hour ago
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But we have still the power of choice: moving consumers away from such closed platforms would affect their business.
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lm28469
51 minutes ago
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At least Apple usually supports their hardware for ~7 years so that's plenty of time to get Asahi working on newer Ms. I don't care too much about getting instant support but I definitely care about having the option to use my hardware more than 7 years
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kace91
1 hour ago
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Thankfully, hardware progress is relatively slow in a way that makes the m1 still a perfectly capable machine. Maybe we’ll have a future of “flagship community devices” where only one of every X is chosen as the supported option.
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jsheard
1 hour ago
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And that's with Apple deliberately leaving the bootloader open on Macs. If they had locked it down like they do on every other product then it would be even more of a struggle, and there's always the looming possibility that they'll just change their mind with future models.
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imiric
57 minutes ago
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This is my main concern. I applaud the effort that the Asahi team is doing, but there's no way that I would rely on a small team of inarguably passionate and talented hackers to maintain a system that uses reverse engineered software running on hardware manufactured by a company historically opposed to everything they're doing, even if they left this small door open for that.

It would be like going back to the days of early Linux and all the Windows-specific hardware we had to deal with, but extrapolated to the entire system. As impressive as all of their work is, it's not worth the IMO minor UX benefits of Apple's hardware.

Mainline Linux on ARM is solid these days; new x86 chips from Intel perform very well and are reasonably power efficient; and battery life of most professional laptops in Linux is quite good. For example, I get a good ~12 hours of work done on an X1 Carbon Gen 13 from a single charge. This may not be as impressive as Macbooks, and the packaging certainly isn't as sleek, but it's good enough for me. The tradeoff for a solid software experience, modulo the usual Linux shenanigans, is worth it to me.

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2OEH8eoCRo0
1 hour ago
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What do you expect when you nerds keep buying their closed systems?
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ForHackernews
1 hour ago
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I've never bought any Mac, but I've been issued several at jobs. At one company, I scandalized the Apple fans by wiping OSX and installing Linux on a 10th gen Macbook Pro.
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logicprog
53 minutes ago
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So all of the nerds that care about open platforms stop buying their systems. Everyone else is going to keep doing it and they number us massively.

And then there's the fact that it's still a dark ending if the best hardware out there — even if we all refuse to buy it because we're on a moral high ground — is a closed platform that we have to refuse to buy.

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Retr0id
1 hour ago
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120Hz is awesome! That was the last feature I personally felt was missing from my M1 Pro MBP.
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thunder_under
1 hour ago
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For me lack of thunderbolt is a showstopper, when it’s supported a lot of needed peripherals will be supported automatically. They have apparently been working on tb support since the m1 was released 4 years ago.
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Noaidi
52 minutes ago
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Just came to praise the seven heroic souls who are working on this wonderful project that my M1 is just waiting to install once battery life meets my needs. And may I ask why, with all the crypto and tech money floating around, does Asahi not have a fully funded staff of fifty people?
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secondcoming
39 minutes ago
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Perhaps you should make the first step towards funding?
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