FilterHN

gurjeet

5 hours ago

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  > Browser Not Supported
  > 
  > PCB Tracer requires a browser that supports access to a local directory.
  > This is needed to save and load your PCB Tracer project files.
  > 
  > Please use Google Chrome or Microsoft Edge for the best experience.

On Firefox, after bypassing the ominous warnings, when I tried to create a new project and choose a directory to save the project files, I get

  > Directory picker is not supported in this browser. Please use a modern browser like Chrome or Edge.

While I appreciate the early warning, so that the user doesn't spend too much effort only to later realize that they can't save their files to disk, I don't appreciate the implicit labeling of Firefox as not being a "modern" browser.

If you're developing a web app with APIs only available in certain browsers, just say/admit so.

assimpleaspossi

2 hours ago

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Remember when some sites called IE a modern browser?

pgt

6 hours ago

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I wanted to test this but if I decline file access I can't do anything. What gives? Do you want people to understand your product? Demo your product.

Why do you need file access to sell me?

Closed immediately.

btw. I am your target market.

fc417fc802

5 hours ago

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Honestly that's exactly what it would look like if someone posted malware to a show HN. I'm not claiming that's what this is, just that it's _exactly_ what it would look like so you'd have to be braindead to go that route.

csmantle

3 hours ago

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If all the app need is to upload a photo of PCB, <input type="file"> is more than sufficient. It's been baseline years ago.

For download, it can download from a blob URI. This is not an uncommon practice.

If (not verified since I'm using Firefox) it claims that "Gerber files are composed of many individual files so that those two don't suffice" and the app does involve Gerber processing, it could have been solved by introducing a zip library.

3 hours ago

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"Gerbers" are indeed several individual files -- there's one for each layer of the PCB, such as front copper, front solder mask, front silkscreen, back copper, back solder mask, etc, etc.

A zip library is precisely how other webapps that load or output Gerbers handle it.

Brian_K_White

5 hours ago

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Support Firefox and do not require filesystem access. Or don't. I'm not your mom. And also not your user.

namuol

5 hours ago

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(I am not the app author, just a sympathizer)

I didn’t realize spite for users was a good reason for me to not bother with Firefox support in my web apps, thank you for enlightening me

Brian_K_White

3 hours ago

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In a few years when you're not 12 any more, you'll be embarassed by this. When that happens, don't sweat it, we were all 12 at some point. I'm just lucky that for me that was before the internet.

DowsingSpoon

2 hours ago

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What are you trying to communicate in this comment? That you have spite for your users? Why? That you consider not bothering with Firefox support to be a good way to, what, express your spite? Do I have that right?

And you thought it good to post this?

ireflect

4 hours ago

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Didn't work in my browser. I degoogled long ago. :shrug:

ProllyInfamous

23 minutes ago

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Same.

Bugs me so much that my mid-sized US city posts official documentation (only) as google drive hyperlinks. I should not have to allow google products onto my networks just to get my recycling schedule, court documents, &c.

So instead, I go into city hall and ask them to print it out for me (they know who I am at this point).

----

My bank is literally right across the street from me; when their 2-factor garbage started preventing me from checking balances, online, I just started walking into their lobby every time I need my balance.

mog_dev

6 hours ago

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Firefox not supported?

https://caniuse.com/native-filesystem-api

5 hours ago

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There was another Show HN recently (today?) that explained this. The JS feature to access local file system is currently not available in FF.

copperx

5 hours ago

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I understand, but why does it need filesystem access in the first place?

4 hours ago

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so you can upload (er, provide access to) an image of a PCB you are looking to trace

Edit: I should have used a different word than upload. It's just old habit. According to TFA, there is no uploading. All processing is done in the browser, so the app needs local file system access to get at your image

3 hours ago

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There are other ways for webpages to get file uploads than this particular JS API. I upload files via firefox every single business day as part of my job.

3 hours ago

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This JS feature doesn't upload the file to a server. This particular app says right there on the page that it does the magic in the browser.

You appear to be misunderstanding on how browsers handle file uploads. You cannot get the local file path for a file. There is no C:\ or /Volumes or whatever your OS uses. Browsers deliberately mask that from the upload.

rcxdude

1 hour ago

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You can 'upload' a file into a completely local web app just fine. The directory access is only necessary if you need the web app to be able to spontaneously write back to the original file on your machine, or if you want to read a whole directory tree, which might be slightly convenient for things like gerbers but can easily be dealt with in other ways (especially with gerbers, which you can distinguish by filename, something that the web browser does expose to javascript).

(and I do think it's kind of irritating that Mozilla is fighting against such useful features on somewhat patronising 'the users won't understand what permission they're granting' grounds)

fc417fc802

4 hours ago

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But I can drag and drop (or use the file picker) just fine on other websites.

3 hours ago

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To do what with? Upload? That's totally not the same thing as providing access for directly manipulating the file. That's basically HTML1.0 type stuff. JS file system access to provide a file to, I'm assuming, a WASM app is not even the same sport to be in the same ballpark.

anonymous_user9

2 hours ago

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Access for directly manipulating the file isn't necessary (perhaps if the files were enormous, but images and Gerber files aren't). One can upload/download files from a local web app just fine on firefox, and the WASM app can act on the file in memory with whatever APIs it wants.

Liftyee

4 hours ago

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I needed exactly this sort of tool for a reverse-engineering project! I was so invested I returned here to write this comment... then spotted the other comments about "no Firefox support". Indeed, visually broken "Browser Not Supported" popup appears.

Darn. Disappointing. Guess I will have to keep looking.

Also... it doesn't look open-source and the comments about file access are valid. The functionality listed is completely possible as a browser-based local app with no server functionality.

Other webapps (https://falstad.com/circuit/) seem to be able to open a file picker in Firefox just fine. Saving is just via downloading to the Downloads folder, but the functionality is not impossible.

infinitewars

4 hours ago

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Does it support non 2-layer boards? (e.g., 4 layer +)

anfractuosity

5 hours ago

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I skimmed through a couple of youtube videos, would I be right in thinking the tracing is done always manually here.

Would be really neat if it could trace automagically too, possibly with sanded PCBs?

raziel2701

6 hours ago

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Firefox not supported and you want to see my local files right away? Nope, not trying this shit.

tamimio

3 hours ago

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I just said it a couple days ago that soon AI will generate pcb and schematics, definitely we are heading that way. In fact, even beyond that, I think it will be as follows: you prompt AI “design a DC-DC voltage step down buck converter circuit” and the AI will download EE skill, design the schematic, test it in MCP connected to circuit simulator, then build the pcb for you, you download the files and send it to the factory.

EEs better start looking at burger king jobs tbh. Funny how AI is notorious at attacking STEM jobs but I see lawyers and doctors are still a protected class due to lobbying and making laws that prevent AI to be used in these fields.

peteforde

4 hours ago

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The overt hostility in this thread really bums me out!

I came to say that this looks amazing and came at the most absurdly perfect time, because I was literally habitually skimming HN before settling in to manually reverse engineer a PCB.

I hope this works well, because it's an extraordinarily useful tool if so.

3 hours ago

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I don't think I've seen much of what I'd call overt hostility. But there do seem to be a lot of firefox users commenting about not being able to use this. I don't think there'd be as many if the site wasn't saying that Firefox isn't supported because it doesn't support access to the local file system for uploads and downloads. But Firefox does indeed support that, just not via whatever API they're using.

peteforde

1 minute ago

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It's just super weird to get downvoted multiple times for saying that I'm excited about something. I guess we won't call that hostility.

The funny thing is that for all of the people complaining about granting filesystem access, it actually won't allow you to select sensitive paths; no system folders, no drive roots.

wrs

5 hours ago

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I wonder (outside HN) what percentage of people who need to reverse engineer a PCB are also people who insist on Firefox. Probably smaller than the percentage of those people who want to save results to their local filesystem.