My heart sank when they said 13 pro and then to see that so much is backwards compatible was amazing. It's quite refreshing to see a company live up to their mission so well.

> shouting out specific team members who did the designs

Inside the case somewhere on mine there was a list of all the names of the people who worked on it. Was pretty cool.

>It's so cool that every individual upgrade they did here can be hot-swapped back to the older designs. That's a huge extra lift that they didn't have to do.

Unfortunately, as is usual for them (and it makes sense; I'm not blaming them), the parts and upgrade kits aren't available for ordering (edit: or pre-ordering) yet, and likely won't be for some time, until the actual laptops are shipping. But yes, this is amazing, and the new pieces are not things I was expecting from them. As soon as it's available, I'll be taking my relatively recent AMD mainboard and putting it in a new chassis+battery+keyboard+speakers+touchpad, possibly skipping the display (I don't care much about a touchscreen, but I do care about display quality, so I'll wait for comparisons to the current 2.8k display). My laptop will, at that point, be almost entirely in a Ship of Theseus situation: I think that only the bezel and some of the expansion cards will be from the original, first-generation laptop I bought from them. That mainboard runs a number of services for me, along with an older display. A second, newer one is waiting for RAM to be a reasonable price (since the RAM it was using is now on my current mainboard); I had planned to use it for some of my research, but maybe I'll end up putting it into this older chassis and have a spare laptop again.

That all this is possible is wonderful, and a credit to them in staying true to their stated ideals.

Isnt that the entire value proposition of the company?

> Having mainline Linux on a system with 24h+ battery life in a 13" case is pretty damn impressive.

Does it have such battery life on Linux? The benchmarks, apart from suspend battery life, are for Windows.

The LPCAMM2 memory is both the biggest plus for me, and the biggest challenge for it given how rare it is to find in stock, and the premium price over LPDDR5 and crazy prices of it.

Featute/performance wise the latest 13s are great for anything work related (I have this small AMD one), but the battery life is pretty awful.

This looks suspiciously like something I could buy : a lightweight well made Linux laptop, with long battery life. I currently use a MacBook and won’t get near a windows machine.

Two questions 1/ will there be a 15 inches version ? ( I’m not getting any younger I like bigger screens ) 2/ software-wise how reliable are the suspend/resume and all the laptop features ? I’ve been using Linux for about 30y and to me this is typically the bits that usually fail. To put it differently, how confident are you that things will work properly out of the box ?

Other than that , I love what you’re doing, please continue.

Really happy to see the new chassis for the 13 Pro! I own the 16 myself, and have been really happy with it, and am excited to see the haptic touchpad + unibody modules hit the marketplace. Those address the largest build quality issues I had with the device.

You probably can't comment on this, but just to note it, I would be very excited to see the 16 get a similar Pro chassis.

Hey Nirav, congrats on the newest release and I'm really eyeing the 13 Pro.

A couple of questions:

1. How are the thermals? I've had mixed experiences with my 11th gen FW 13 throttling under load with the fan sounding noisy. It's fine if I'm alone but if I'm at a team gathering, it's noticeably loud.

2. Does the lid open with one hand?

Does the Dolby treatment carry into Linux with comparable performance, or does "best sound" require Windows?

I preordered a 13 Pro with Ryzen, which I'm already very excited about. Reading between the lines of your video announcement, though, it seems like the Intel experience might be more optimal (you pointed out Intel's new low power efficiency cores and Dolby sound being tested with Intel).

If I want the best battery life and sound possible with Linux, should I switch my preorder to Intel?

All the battery life stats use Windows for testing. How does the equivalent Linux performance compare?

Are you guys thinking about pushing to improve the linux software experience at all? To me that could almost be another selling point, if Framework 13 came with some downstream patches that improved sleep, power management, multi-display and hi-dpi monitor handling, etc.

And secondly how healthy is framework as a company, and to what extent do you make money from consumers vs sales to big companies?

I'm excited for the new speakers - that's been one of the biggest pain points on my 13.

- Is the Dolby Atmos configuration available for Linux as well as Windows? Or more generally, will the speakers sound as good on Linux as they do on Windows?

- Will we be able to get audio comparison samples between the old and new speakers?

Any plans to have a keyboard with a trackpoint and thumb buttons? I Don't need a trackpad.

If you add this then you'll have a new customer for life.

The trackpoint is the only thing that keeps me chained to Thinkpads.

First off, Framework is maybe the most exciting company I've seen over the last 5 years. My Framework 13 AMD is a wonderful machine. Thank you to your and your team for the incredible work and commitment!

Two questions:

1. Will there will be a concrete guide to upgrading a standard Framework 13 to the Pro. I watched the video and read the page a few times, and I'm a bit confused what the whole process is and if all the required upgrades need to happen together, or if they can go piece meal.

2. With all the different components and increasing SKUs, I'd be a little worried that if I didn't upgrade to a Pro in the near future, that the old hardware would no longer be supported and it'd be a headache to upgrade at some point. Can Framework guarantee that there will always be an upgrade path within a size and line?

Again, big thank you to Framework and I look forward to using my Framework 13 for a long, long time :)

I’d prefer a non-touchscreen. Touchscreen does add about 200g of weight. Is that likely to be an option?

I love it, I've been waiting for years to buy a Framework, but my current laptop has so far refused to die. I think it's now finally old enough to justify upgrading.

Will the new keyboard colour schemes come to other locales? I love the orange/black/grey but probably not enough to learn American English.

You magnificent bastard, you know just how to suck money out of my wallet. And it's not even Christmas yet :-)

What would it take you to ship to Norway?

How well does the haptic trackpad stack up against the ones found in macbooks?

Question: did the hints given at https://frame.work/nextgen include any secret messages you want the public to know about? Maybe the secret was missed during the run up to today?

Is the keyboard for the 13 pro the same?

The upgrade kits I'm seeing on the marketplace have a keyboard included.

Would it be possible to have a input cover pro, bottom cover pro, batteries pro, speakers pro and use my existing keyboard?

Qmk support for the keyboard, like the Laptop 16 has?

Any blue-sky thinking like 256GB RAM support?

I have a feeling that laptops don't keep up with the today's dev workflows.

Will the hinges be 360 like the laptop 12? I wonder how useful the touchscreen will be without it.

Thanks Nirav, always appreciated :)

P.S. The printer gag was cruel, just saying.

Why is this not offered with a decent keyboard? Proper key caps and meaningful travel.

Are you going to continue to partner with the ethnonationalist weirdo DHH?

Thank you for supporting DHH/Omarchy and Hyprland. You took a lot of flak from woke scolding children online and didn't fold like a cheap suit. Made me a customer last year.

To compare anecdotes, I’ve had mine for 3 years, and it’s still working great. Haven’t had any issues with it.

Does MBP run Linux? That would be the selling point for me ... But I guess I am not in a big group.

Also MBP is not really repairable at all.

Dumb comparison, because buying a Framework is a single transaction where I exchange money for a computer, and buying a Mac is an entrypoint to “The Ecosystem” where Apple wants to squeeze me for $<pricing_tier>/month forever.

Peep the margins on “Products” versus “Services” and you will understand what Apple's incentives are and why just selling me hardware isn't it: https://www.apple.com/newsroom/pdfs/fy2026-q1/FY26_Q1_Consol...

Also very sad that the M5 dominates the X7 358H in singlethreaded performance, not to mention the M5 Pro that dominates it in both single- and multithreaded performance.

At least it's available in the UK

I've wanted to get a Framework for a long time now, but their lack of shipping to Israel (and active prevention of using Freight forwarders) has prevented me.

If they were willing to sell me the 13 Pro, I'd sell my Yoga Pro 7 in a heartbeat to replace with a 13 Pro

This is largely driven by RAM prices, which is a real shame.

Everything that isn’t a MacBook will be more expensive than a MacBook, so you should choose a price you want to spend and then evaluate if you prefer a Framework or a Mac at that price point. If your available spending power is too low for a Framework, you’re not getting a Framework — and, separately, if you want a Framework for some reason specific to the Framework and can afford one, then the price of a Mac isn’t relevant unless a Mac can satisfy that same reason.

Same in Germany, it ends around similar Apple and Thinkpad prices.

On top of it, intel chips are not competitive with apple silicon. Why buy a laptop that's 30% slower and uses more energy for the same price?

how would they compare over 10-15 years though. with one you are able to swap out the motherboard when you want an upgrade and with the other you have to buy a completely new device.

then when it comes to repairing broken parts they are on opposite ends of the scale where apple actually go out of their way to make it harder for you to do that and its probably more expensive as well since only apple certified repair shops have access to certain parts

Comparing it to a MacBook misses the point. The reason to buy the framework is modularity, repairability, customisability. You can upgrade your CPU, add specific ports you want, change ram. You can't do any of that with a Mac.

For reference, comparing against a budget laptop:

Leno 14.1": £300.19 (i7-8650U, 16GB, 1TB) Leno 14.1": £341.59 (i7-8650U, 32GB, 1TB)

https://aliexpress.com/item/1005010289025003.html

This is a tough one because a macbook pro hooks you into the apple ecosystem and makes apple money. Let alone the macbook neo.

This is like the really cheap televisions that harvest your data for profit.

How can you compete/compare against vizio if it makes more on your data than on the television?

14" macbook pro with those specs is ~2100. 200 dollar delta for repair-ability seems acceptable to me.

But you can upgrade it later by swapping parts and not buying a new machine, so it should be cheaper in the long run.

I am sure many will jump in here to talk about the upgradability story, but for me personally I do not think of Macbooks as a serious alternative either way. Even if I could get over not being able to replace my hard drive or RAM, I would still have to be OK using a proprietary OS I can't control, designed by people who just want to keep extracting my money ultimately.

Having something called an "App Store" on my personal laptop I can't remove.. I'd deal with having 4gb of RAM before I lived that reality.

I did last year after deciding that Apple's software just isn't for me anymore. I've always had a Linux desktop around (and used to daily drive Linux on a laptop years ago) so I was happy to consolidate on my preferred platform.

Biggest gripes I had are:

A) battery life (both during use and standby just kinda sucking on Linux in general compared to os x, not exactly framework specific but I did get used to how amazing my m1 pro for longevity)

B) the case looking nice but feeling a little flimsy

C) the speakers are pretty bad (though I did get turned on to easyeffects and there is a profile for the 13 which helped a bit)

D) macs completely spoiled me trackpad wise

It seems like they are taking a stab at all of these in some way and I'm excited to see how it goes, especially with so much being backwards compatible.

I use a MacBook Pro at work and a Framework 13 for personal use. The biggest downside to my Framework 13 is the low battery life; I’ve been getting only about 5 hours on Windows 11. Other than that, I like my Framework 13.

I am very excited about the Framework 13 Pro and it’s dramatically improved battery life. It’s unfortunate regarding RAM prices, though; I only paid $96 for 32GB of DDR5 RAM back in December 2023 when I ordered my Framework 13 (I bought my RAM on Newegg). It’s much more expensive today. I’d like to upgrade, but I can’t afford it at today’s RAM prices. With that said, because the RAM is still modular in the Framework 13 Pro, I could settle for a lower configuration and wait until a later date to upgrade the RAM.

I never used a Mac for my personal machine, but I've always used them as my work machines. I purchased the first generation of the Framework 13 AMD laptops And it's been my personal machine ever since. It's a damn fine machine and I love having full control over the components in my machine without some OEM nonsense for repairs that manufacturers like Dell try to pull (wouldn't accept non-OEM batteries for me in the past).

The battery life is the biggest negative compared to a MacBook, but that seems to be better now (though I doubt it, or anyone, can compete with the power/performance that Apple is putting out now).

The issue with my advice to you though is that I prefer Linux. And I would be running Linux at work if I could. Mac OS is fine, but I do prefer Linux as my main operating system.

If I didn't specifically want to run Linux, though, I would probably be using a MacBook, despite their lack of repairability.

All that said, I really love my framework and I don't intend on buying another machine any time soon, especially because I can upgrade my Framework 5 years from now (hopefully).

I was a Mac guy for 12+ years and switched to Linux on desktop + Framework about 2 years ago.

It takes time. On many dimensions, the Framework running Linux is laughably worse. I never thought about battery life while the lid is closed until my Framework.

That being said, running Linux is very fun and can be productive if you choose a well-supported distribution and desktop environment. I landed on KDE Plasma and Fedora/Kununtu. It has been my daily driver and I see no reason to go back.

My gateway to Linux was buying an old Thinkpad T580 and messing around Arch Linux. If you’re on the fence, this may be a good place to start.

I have a MacBook Air M2. I bought a framework 13 last year right before the RAM shortage. I really wanted to love it but ended up returning it due to really bad battery life performance (NixOS). Still on the MacBook today, but heavily considering the new framework

I did. Linux obliterates Mac in agentic workflows.

I was on a Macbook Pro (multiple models for many years) and jumped to the 12th gen intel framework. It is fantastic laptop, just showing its age a bit (mostly battery life as I still have the smaller battery and 12th gen intel wasn't that great for battery).

I upgraded the screen and speakers, nothing else really needed changing throughout the years.

I was so tired of the bad docker performance on macOS that I went to a framework with Linux. Linux on a laptop (Fedora/Gnome specifically) worked so much better than I expected too.

I'm hopeful I can pre-order this new model as well.

Doesn't it work perfectly with a 2880px-wide display with 2x scaling?

As a heavy fractional scaling user, as long as the display has enough DPI, it's a non-issue. At my last job I was happily running 1.35 scaling, and I run my TV at 1.5 scaling. Make sure you're using a sane compositor, which excludes DWM; most Wayland compositors should run just fine.

on omarchy ill switch with super + / and use 1x, 1.6x and 2x when needed.

1.6x works surprisingly well now, that wasnt the case a couple years ago

Forget fractional scaling, just keep scale at 100% and increase font and icon sizes.

Don't forget literally all the battery values are specified as Windows 11.

Well you know how it is on linux, one wrong move and pulseaudio needs restarting lol.

They write their own software. And firmware. Other OEMs can just beg their tier 1/2 suppliers to get their shit together and put components to sleep properly by making windows, drivers, and firmware work well together.

Also things like lpddr5x, ssd controller built into the SoC with cache in unified ram (instead of running a whole ass separate computer with its own ram on an m2 stick) etc

Mainly because Microsoft wants to have "connected standby": the CPU is running in a low power mode (not powered off like "old" S3 sleep), can be turned on periodically and can turn on other devices even when the computer is "sleeping".

My Zen2 based Lenovo laptop has 6-7 hours of battery when doing basic tasks in both Windows and Linux, but sleep on Linux lasts a week while on Windows it's empty in 24 hours.

Trying to reduce idle power use of a simple esp32 based project I did a while back... Yeah it is indeed tricky. Apple having full control of their hardware supply chain, firmware and software helps a ton. And PC standardization issues do no good either.

On the other hand framework is actually in a good position to do something about it. Similar to valve. I think they do have more control than a regular PC vendor when also using Linux ad they have a very limited portfolio of devices and can actually upstream software fixes.

I think it's just a vertical integration thing. They know what's in the machine and they can make sure that their suspend path puts every peripheral to sleep. Linux has no idea what's in your machine and there may be some device in there somewhere that freaks out if the machine goes to sleep without saying goodnight. Even a 50mW draw will destroy the suspend power budget. Chromebooks have similar vertical integration with respect to ChromeOS and they also enjoy long sleep life. Hypothetically an integrator like Framework can also guarantee this but I can't vouch for it being true, and they would not have any control over Ubuntu updates after the laptop is delivered to the customer.

Just to beat my favorite dead horse, this is why the insistence on SO-DIMMs "BEcAuse it's rEpAIrAble" has wrecked the reputation of a lot of laptops. DDR on a stick is fundamentally hostile to sleep power draw. Soldered-down LPDDR memory has always been massively superior for energy savings, and LP-CAMM finally solves the issue.

to be fair, your money isn't as good as VC money for RAM at the moment

It doesn't meet all of them. AMD considered it for Strix Halo but said it didn't meet their latency requirements.

Intel Core Ultra 3xx is mostly better than AMD Ryzen 3xx/4xx. This year you're better off with Intel.

Hear, hear!

FWIW, the ordering page lets you also choose AMD Ryzen 350 / HX 370. It's not the Strix Halo chips you're hoping for, but it is something.

Where are you getting that this doesn't have a unified memory model? This laptop uses an iGPU with shared memory.

I will guess for linux. Most out of the box linux laptops I saw were intel based. I guess open source support of intel is best among others in the industry. Even in my current thinkpad first thing I did was to replace its wifi module from realtek to intel (realtek was always hanging/dropping connection etc).

Why?

Quick search shows LPCAMM2 at 7500MT/s is about 120GB/s, which seems about on par with M4 base and a bit better than DDR5.

BTW as an AMD fanboy and stockholder, Intel's latest generation of CPUs is quality.

> hamstring this thing with Intel.

Have you missed all the recent Intel news or something?

All four ports support Thunderbolt 4 - if you scroll down to "Interfaces" on the product specs page there's a graphic showing everything that's supported.

The Page Up/Page Down solution I can work with. It's also valuable to not have too many keys, especially in a 13" notebook.

But those cursor keys were not designed by serious people. My pet theory is that kind of people who make those industrial designs don't work with lots of text and thus don't understand the pain. Apple made the same mistake years ago, perhaps for similar reasons. But to their credit and somewhat uncharacteristically, they course-corrected quickly. I don't get why Framework is so stubborn about this, I'm sure they hear this all the time.

I went on the configurator page briefly, like 400$ for 32GB IIRC.

They don't ship to where I am so I didn't stay long

> That's a non-starter. Why not 128GB or push boundary for 256GB?

128GB might be possible only on the Ultra 5 325 once sufficiently large LPCAMM2 modules have been release but the Ultra X7 358H and Ultra X9 388H only support 96 GB. Support for 256 GB would likely require a desktop processor, or a redesign from Intel to support a quarter terabyte of memory on a mobile processor.

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/sku/245720/...

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/sku/245527/...

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/sku/245526/...

Because no one makes larger LPCAMM2 modules. But Framework's CEO says he expects higher density modules in the future: https://youtu.be/GnOpIQJnYWU?si=UBMfW7SsiNjwJ1fo&t=292

Last I checked, one kidney might not even suffice to pay for 256GB anymore.

Maybe because 64 GB is $849.

This is the next Framework I will buy, unless AMD's AI 400 series is better.

I await a Linux-based battery test for both active work and overnight suspend consumption. I don't think suspend battery drain is vendor-specific though; AMD and Intel both shat the bed compared to Apple due to hardware decision-making.

edit: I missed this.

>7 days Standby without charging, Wi-Fi connected on Ubuntu

No numpad

I hope you’re being sarcastic because if not you’re delisional to expect ECC ram in a laptop. You’re going to pile up software updates that you should absolutely reboot for long before a comic ray causes a meaningful bit flip. ECC is only worthwhile in servers and is a waste of money otherwise, especially since “pro” for laptop = prosumer device.

If you don’t reboot your laptop in years where ECC matters I’m not sure how to help you.

Does the LPCAMM2 standard allow for a full-blown ECC interface, as opposed being limited to the on-die ECC that's part of the DDR5 spec?

Let's all thank the AI industry for this.