The Pentagon is running an AI propaganda mill targeting Latin America
119 points
3 days ago
| 13 comments
| theintercept.com
| HN
oefrha
3 days ago
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I’d be shocked if the Pentagon isn’t running an AI propaganda mill targeting <insert any region of the world>.
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PearlRiver
2 days ago
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You too can have no healthcare, no pension and no job security! Sign up to America today.
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penguin_booze
2 days ago
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For those who signed up, the lessons are in the post.
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dm_
3 days ago
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What I think many of the jaded comments about how "it was ever thus" miss is what it means that American soft power is reduced to AI slop.

During the Cold War, the CIA famously funded all sorts of cultural endeavors, but much of the output (if not directly CIA-created, then at least bolstered by the Agency) is still held to have been culturally relevant: abstract expressionism (https://www.bbc.com/culture/article/20161004-was-modern-art-...), the Kenyon Review (https://www.thecollegianmagazine.com/the-kenyon-review-and-t...), etc.

Lots to criticize in the Cold War, but I think you can at least make the argument that this was emblematic of an American cultural power that was self-assured of its own value and legitimacy.

In comparison, now we have...LLMs creating personal finance tips?

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rchaud
2 days ago
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School of Americas-trained death squads on one hand and hoity-toity arts and culture on the other. Soft power certainly casts a wide net.
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dm_
2 days ago
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Yeah, good point. And I think you could probably make a fair case that the choice of where to apply that sort of ugly anti-democratic violence and subversion probably reflected culturally chauvinist and racist ideas about which cultures would be receptive to hoity toity arts and culture (European, White) and which would not (the others).

But I don't know that I find a lot of fault with, like, funding the Kenyon Review. That sort of seems like a fine thing to do. I'm not sure there's a discernible difference between that and just sort of generally funding arts and culture, which a) seems fine, but b) also certainly serves to aggrandize "our" culture and promote the glory of "our" way of life.

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applicative
2 days ago
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None of these were significant either, not worth even 1 neuron -- but they did provide a bit of copy for upscale yankee-CIA tinfoil-hat journalism - even books - a few decades later.
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JumpCrisscross
3 days ago
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Genuine question, were we ever great at this?
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dm_
2 days ago
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If "we" = "the USA":

1. I think the examples I linked to are real, in the sense that they were both a) CIA funded (or boosted) and b) are broadly credible cultural output.

2. Voice of America was a real media outlet with real cultural impact.

There are also non-American examples. The BBC World Service is (or was) pretty widely listened to, which strikes me as a pretty big soft-power boost for an otherwise waning colonial power.

I do think what separates those from (apparently) this example is that they were all output that had genuine value to the target audience. That's sort of like the discussion around USAID: it was, indeed, also often CIA-adjacent and, during the Cold War, was anything but a purely altruistic endeavor (which is why it's so funny to see reactionaries describing it as some sort of bleeding-heart operation), but it nonetheless provided genuine value to recipients of its relatively meager budget.

What seems to be the dominant philosophy in Washington now is either a) America can get all the same cultural influence for cheap via AI, or b) soft power influence doesn't matter anyway because America has the Tomahawk missiles.

I think both of those views are likely to be incorrect.

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phs318u
2 days ago
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The USA meddling in South American politics? Say it ain’t so!

It’s so bizarre to me that in the US heartland, Latinos are demonised, yet beyond US borders they care so much about the democratic welfare of their South American amigos.

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oobeoob11
3 days ago
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Well, yes, obviously. Did you notice there is also one (rather, a whole ecosystem) targeting Russia, one for Iran, one for China, one for EU, one for Japan, etc?
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JumpCrisscross
3 days ago
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> one (rather, a whole ecosystem) targeting Russia, one for Iran, one for China

I'm fine with this.

> one for EU, one for Japan, etc?

I'm not okay with this. Wouldn't lump the two together.

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tclover
2 days ago
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That’s what someone full of propaganda would say
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yanhangyhy
3 days ago
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If the American system is so good, why does it always need to be promoted in such strange ways? LA people should be so eager to be pro-America
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DonsDiscountGas
2 days ago
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If <company product> is so good why do they spend so much money on marketing?

Information is not self recommending. There's a lot going on in the world, attention is scarce. Moreso today than ever before, but it's been true for a long time.

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bpodgursky
2 days ago
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China is doing propaganda. Russia is doing propaganda. Iran is doing propaganda. That's life, play the game or lose.

This is like sales and marketing, idealists think you can build the perfect product and it will sell itself. It won't. It's an adversarial marketplace and you have to show the world what you did, against people who are trying to tear you down.

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RickJWagner
2 days ago
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I just left Reddit, where a Cuban that moved to America is hosting an AMA.

It’s incredible. The guy seems to be giving brutally real opinions, the good and the bad, and telling his life’s story. Reddit readers ( admitting they’ve never been to Cuba ) try to shout him down and tell him what he should be thinking.

It’d be nice to hear more first hand stories like that.

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hagbard_c
2 days ago
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It is an arms race just like any other. Country A says "we're the best", country B says "Country A is a bunch of liars, look at us", country C says "in contrast to the clear propaganda coming from A and B the truth is that we've found the answer to every question", A counters with "B does nasty things to ${ethnic_group}", B says "C stole every answer from us", C says "A and B are ruled by geriatric know-nothings", etc. Propagandists are going to propagandise no matter whether they're in a representational republic, a democracy, a constitutional monarchy, an oligarchy or a dictatorship. Some of the propaganda is closer to the truth than other but it is still propaganda.
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JumpCrisscross
3 days ago
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> If the American system is so good

Putin doesn't plaster Europe with propaganda because he thinks the Russian system is good. He does it for power. And if your system is that good, propaganda is effective.

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thrance
2 days ago
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There's a joke that goes something like this:

> A Soviet visits America and says: "Wow, the propaganda is so good here! Much better than back home", an American replies: "What propaganda!? We don't have propaganda here!", to which the Soviet responds: "Exactly!".

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JumpCrisscross
3 days ago
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When it comes to traditional spycraft, I'm of the opinion that everyone does it and everyone has to. Everyone does it. It's of tremendous value. And it doesn't particularly hurt us when we get caught.

But the First Amendment is a cultural touchstone for America. Even if everyone else does this nonsense, it's not of demonstrable value and it does hurt us when we get caught like this. Unilateral disarmament isn't usually an option. But it is, I think, when it comes to this.

I think we should pass a law banning undisclosed social media, psyop and other unattributed propaganda campaigns among (a) allies and (b) other democracies (as judged by a neutral source).

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sometimelurker
2 days ago
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you can actually learn a lot about the world by just guessing whats happening. you don't even need to read the news, you can just guess correctly.
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shakna
3 days ago
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Have they ever stopped? CIA and SOCOM have been dangling themselves into Latin American lives since they were invented. Assassinating presidents, spewing propaganda, assisting in coups.

It would be a surprise, it they weren't using AI to add to the mix.

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skeledrew
2 days ago
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> Enter your email to keep reading for free. > This is not a paywall.

Yes it is. I'm supposed to pay with my email and chance to be spammed. No, I won't be doing so.

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NoGravitas
2 days ago
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Thankfully, it works in reader mode, and you don't even have to go to a paywall bypass.
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zuzululu
3 days ago
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This is odd. They have the budget to run with real journalists and outlets. Is this some reverse-psychology move? Where they want people to see that its AI and thus not take it seriously? What aim does that achieve?
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Cthulhu_
3 days ago
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Real journalists / content writers have pesky morals and tend to become whistleblowers when they've had enough.
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FooBarWidget
2 days ago
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What are you talking about? There are entire groups of renowned "journalists" that turn out to be CIA collaborators. The renowned New York Times admitted they receive approval from the US government. Bellingcat, renowed "independent investigative journalists", turns out to be CIA-funded, and is awfully quiet with their investigations in situations where it does not suit NATO allies' agenda.

There's a reason why the public distrusts journalists more and more. Many people still think the problems are limited to domestic journalism, and haven't connected the dots yet w.r.t. that foreign policy journalism is just as bad, if not worse.

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applicative
2 days ago
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The only systematic state propaganda in question is the propaganda you are retailing here. Bellingcat-o-mania in particular is a pure, paid, propaganda initiative of Putin's Assadist phase. Billions were spent to produce armies of brains that type what you just typed.
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FooBarWidget
1 day ago
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Do you think the fourth estate is working as it should?
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lesuorac
2 days ago
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And yet people love X which pretty famously during the "Twitter Files" was revealed to also assist US psy-ops.

The public just distrusts large organizations now because those large organizations haven't been effective with their stated missions.

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applicative
2 days ago
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Nothing interesting, much less sinister, is happening on the site though - and it seems to have zero traffic. It is likely just spreading encrypted signals to the military elsewhere.
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vintermann
3 days ago
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It's not necessarily easy to find people who will want to work with that, especially when you were the Trump administration.

I mean there used to be a fair amount of government loyalists remaining, working for outlets like Voice of America who, probably, sincerely thought they were doing a good thing. But they butted head with the Trump administration hard.

For all loyalists there is a grifter to true believer ratio, and for the current admin it's bad. Why pay a hard-to-find true believer to make actually convincing propaganda, when you're a grifter yourself and have the opportunity to take the budget for yourself and let an LLM half-ass it?

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gdss
3 days ago
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yep, with brazil at the center...
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postsantum
3 days ago
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Brazil did a hecking bad thing. PIX can't be allowed, let alone expand
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gdss
2 days ago
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alright bro no one is taking you serious
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dmvjs
2 days ago
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oh just the one?
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rurban
3 days ago
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Hollywood is not just targeting Latin America. Marvel and DC are everybody fascists dreams.
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