Your Kids' School Bus Is About to Become a Roaming Surveillance Vehicle
61 points
1 hour ago
| 8 comments
| thedrive.com
| HN
defrost
54 minutes ago
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This has been an ongoing concern (internal surveillance of children and drivers, external of other traffic) for at least two months now:

* They're Putting AI Cameras In School Buses (April 7th 2026) - https://www.usermag.co/p/theyre-putting-ai-cameras-in-school

* School bus Driver Interview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoAvL1MoTIA

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jo6gwb
1 hour ago
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Look up the history of this company, bus patrol - they're felons and in prison.
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buellerbueller
25 minutes ago
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I guess once someone is a felon, they should never be allowed income? You might be right to criticize the company itself, but is their specific felonious behavior problematic (if so, you haven't spelled that out)? The way you say it, just the fact of them being felons is the problem.
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NDlurker
18 minutes ago
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Never being allowed income and getting contracts for mass surveillance are not the same thing.
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Bender
20 minutes ago
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Perhaps not managing AI camera systems that track children. There are plenty of other career options.
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tristor
1 hour ago
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I read a few different articles such as https://www.thenewspaper.com/news/67/6717.asp and https://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/corrupt-public-official-sen...

It seems like it's not BusPatrol, but a company they acquired (Force Multiplier Solutions) that had corrupt leadership. I'm not sure how exactly that went down, or if the same people are still involved, but it does sound pretty bad. Apparently the corruption here caused the Dallas County Schools to go bankrupt and ultimately to be shut down and the school district split into other surrounding districts to take over.

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senkora
38 minutes ago
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This is the first that I'm hearing about this, but I don't think that your telling is quite right. The Dallas school district is "Dallas ISD", not Dallas County Schools.

Dallas County Schools was apparently a school bus service provider that served many different school districts in the area. I don't know why they named it that...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas_County_Schools

That situation looks pretty bad, but what happened was that a public school bus services provider went bankrupt, the school districts that it served became responsible for finding private replacement service providers, and residents of the service area had their property taxes raised to pay off the debt.

No school districts went bankrupt or were split up, just school bus service providers.

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dismalaf
38 minutes ago
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Who'd have thought a bus company would run buses for the various applications that buses are used for.
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cf100clunk
26 minutes ago
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That point-of-view doesn't soothe anyone alarmed by expansion of warrantless law enforcement surveillance.
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arjie
18 minutes ago
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The existence of a license plate indicates that motor vehicle travel is not intended to be untrackable. That makes sense since these are powerful devices. It seems like a fair trade off since a motor vehicle provides many benefits but also high risk.
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Sayrus
8 minutes ago
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Why stop at tracking license plates? Once you've started you should report on pedestrians, bikes, whether people are at-home, which building people are entering, the way they walk and many more. Those are all "alternative revenue streams" that are as valid from the operator/investor point of view and completely unrelated to whether the way of transportation or activity is meant to be untrackable or unrelated to a way of transportation at all.

There is also a factor of scale: a cop can follow you, but a system where everyone is monitored 24/7 is a very different story.

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goda90
3 minutes ago
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What does being a powerful device mean in regards to location tracking? Safe operation tracking makes sense, but location doesn't.
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alistairSH
13 minutes ago
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In a vacuum, I agree. But, license plate readers aren't limited to investigating crime/misuse of vehicle, nor are they limited to the government.

Tracking vehicles and linking that movement to individual movement (and spending and browsing and and and) used to be massively expensive, if not impossible.

Now all that tracking is "cheap" and being done at scale for all sorts of reasons.

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nayuki
1 hour ago
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Maybe design cities to be walkable and bikeable so that you have the option get things done without driving a car which is inherently trackable?
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jerf
24 minutes ago
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That's not the problem. Wave a magic wand and have all cities walkable and bikeable and you'd still have school busses.

I suppose we could wave more magic wands and say "ok, everybody with kids has to live in a city whether they like it or not" and wave some more magic wands and eliminate all concerns about crime or other dangers, but if we're going to wave this many magic wands maybe we should just wave one that makes it so children don't need to go to school at all because they are all magically educated already.

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Bender
15 minutes ago
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I don't know if that works in the EU but in the US most places are not a city and most places whilst technically walkable the kids will have to start walking at 4am and maybe they will get to school on time after walking along rural highways and on dirt roads. That would be incredibly dangerous, reckless and irresponsible.

As for tracking, I want more of it by individuals just not centralized corporations. The porch pirate bosses often park in front of my place to watch their minions of whom snatch packages around the time that kids are getting home. Some of the porch pirate minions drive vans and could easily snatch kids. I have been encouraging many of the people in my area to install cameras that log license plates and catch faces and vehicles in multiple directions of their roads and highways. We've removed some of the organized crime and pushed some of it out of this area and we will continue to push harder.

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vel0city
4 minutes ago
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> in the US most places are not a city

Most people in the US live in urban areas. Most US citizens live in cities. The urban population of the US is about 80% of the population.

I do agree most students in the US arrive by bus or car, but that's not because most US citizens live on farms off country highways.

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Bender
3 minutes ago
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That does not make what I said not relevant. People are spread out across the country and kids in rural areas are just as valuable as kids in cities. I would never trust anyone that says otherwise. Also most of the land is not walkable in any realistic sense. Busses and cars are not likely going away for the duration of this short civilization. We will hit the great filter before better options may have arrived.
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allturtles
11 minutes ago
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So someone introduces a new, problematic feature to a long-existing technical system, and your answer is to "just" reorganize all of society to eliminate that system?
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embedding-shape
58 minutes ago
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Wish granted, now cameras are put up on every walk path and bus stop instead, as people keep getting robbed to/from the stores, so while the school buses aren't fitted with cameras, the streets are instead.
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cucumber3732842
37 minutes ago
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I'll take it a step further.

Condoning the surveillance state because it makes the things they want people to like less comparatively worse is exactly the sort of evil "use anything as leverage to advance my goals" behavior is exactly how we got here.

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MaxHoppersGhost
29 minutes ago
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The vast majority of folks don't want to walk/bike in Phoenix, Atlanta, Houston, New Orleans, etc where it's near or over 100 degrees in the summer.
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hombre_fatal
22 minutes ago
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But those people don't even have the option, so what do you mean they prefer to not walk/bike? How pleasant walking/biking will be is linked to density, reduced distance to amenities, and infrastructure, things almost no US cities have.

I live blocks from Costco in one of those cities but the option is either get on my bike and share the four-lane road with aggressive drivers in massive trucks/SUVs or use a tiny sidewalk that randomly stops and picks up again a block or two later.

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SoftTalker
6 minutes ago
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What are you going to buy at Costco that you can carry home on a bike?

In other words, if you want to bike to get your groceries, Costco is the wrong choice.

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lenerdenator
6 minutes ago
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Wait until you try putting a Costco-sized bulk package of something on a bike.
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lenerdenator
7 minutes ago
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> Maybe design cities to be walkable and bikeable

Why does everyone suggest this like it's easily done and the only reason that we haven't is due to lack of intelligence and/or will?

It's not. It's an effort that will take decades, cost trillions of dollars, and will face both legislative and legal hurdles.

Besides, with individual trait recognition technology and smartphones, you'll just be tracked regardless. You have to hold leaders to account for this sort of abuse of power.

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NoSalt
44 minutes ago
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I, for one, do not wish to smell my malodorous coworkers - who have walked or cycled to work and are all sweaty - all day. I already have one of them and it makes me want to vomit.
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vel0city
1 minute ago
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Yeah, we need to further normalize and require people never spending any time outside. I'm sure that'll go well for our society.
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fuzzy2
32 minutes ago
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Man if only there was a solution to this. It's almost as if we could design our environment to minimize this (bike- and pedestrian-friendly routes) and then deal with the aftermath if it happens anyway (showers).

I do not consider employers that do not offer showers.

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cf100clunk
39 minutes ago
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There are ways to gently inform the person(s) of your discomfort. If communicated well, it can be settled. In one case I dealt with, body odour of someone on my team was causing another person distress, but some gentle, kind advice (yes, it was embarrassing as hell so we did it in private) and a quick trip by him to the shops for some deodorant resolved the problem almost instantly. Here's hoping.
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nicbou
33 minutes ago
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There are many ways to avoid this. The problem is your co-worker, not cyclists.
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dismalaf
39 minutes ago
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While I'm sympathetic to a lot of privacy concerns, how hard is it to simply not be an asshole and not pass school buses when they have their flashing lights out?

Also, every car with a dashcam or built in cameras is basically already this. Where I live every intersection has cameras. Most of the buildings. It's not like this is anything new and honestly, probably a better use of cameras than most of the other applications.

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cf100clunk
37 minutes ago
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The concern is the sharing of such surveillance with law enforcement and other government agencies.
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jasonlotito
20 minutes ago
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> how hard is it to simply not be an asshole and not pass school buses when they have their flashing lights out?

As a parent with children who take the bus... this actually doesn't matter. You can't assume that the car's owner is passing the school bus. So, this is a case of finding someone guilty with no physical evidence. And the real fear there is that suddenly you are guilty because someone else was using your Wi-Fi, and you suddenly have the burden of proof to prove your innocence.

> Where I live every intersection has cameras.

And now you are guilty of crimes. Prove you didn't do them.

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cucumber3732842
33 minutes ago
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a) it doesn't actually happen that often

b) when it does it's usually some stupid situation where robotic adherence to the lights is in poor taste (like a bus picking up or discharging an entire team on a right side curb, or a divided median) albeit legally mandated.

c) School bus drivers already radio in plate numbers of anyone who does it in poor taste and the buses mostly already have dashcams so this isn't really solving a problem

Source: bus driver in the family

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buellerbueller
21 minutes ago
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Happens more school days than not on my street.
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xhkkffbf
30 minutes ago
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Yes, this is concerning. But there's also the other side. Some of the little miscreants who shared my bus ride were positively nasty. Some surveillance would have helped a number of people avoid bullying.
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giantg2
5 minutes ago
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That's only true if the school will actually do something based the surveillance evidence. It seems many do not.
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jeffbee
28 minutes ago
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People who pass through red signals need a night or two in jail, not enhanced privacy protections.
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nayuki
26 minutes ago
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True, but the article is complaining about other innocent people that might get caught in the surveillance dragnet.
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user142
35 minutes ago
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Judging by the enthusiasm for hosted AI models and tools like Claude Code on Hacker News, I don't think people care much about surveillance anymore.
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