▲papaver-somnamb28 minutes ago
[-] After reading their newspaper (their label, not mine) for years, I've come away with three revelations:
A) More than gaining insight and staying abreast of events, what I was really purchasing was the /feeling/ of being in-the-know.
B) Whenever I met with "certain" people, they were likely to also read The Economist which turned out to be another, tremendously handy means of anchoring conversation.
C) The trade balance tables on the inside back page were always interesting, sometimes jaw-dropping.
reply▲I'd love to know if "the pink" has the same problem because I used to find the editorial very good. As a non-investor, left leaning voter, it interested me that I found much to agree with in "the financial times" while still finding much to disagree with in "the times" and "the daily telegraph" and "the spectator" -as if money was more neutrally stanced on left-vs-right.
reply▲If you’re a left leaning voter the Speccie is almost _never_ going to have an article for you.
And the “almost” is simply because often the articles are very well written and a pleasure to read even when the actual topic and argument are deeply deranged. Amazingly this was especially true when Boris was the editor!
Why is that amazing? For all his faults, Boris Johnson is an excellent writer.
reply▲carabiner20 minutes ago
[-] Chomsky said it was the only newspaper that told the truth.
reply▲Yes.
The pink is also wrong more often than not when they're talking about non-European issues.
When they talk about Europe they lie.
Subtle difference.
The view amongst the economically literate left (the LSE?) when I was in the UK, was that lying about money to money-makers was counter productive.
I tend to think this is true. The economist doesn't project into quite the same mindset of outcome, so I still think (despite your polemic) it's less likely the fin randomly lies about things, but I'm prepared to consider it on it's merits if somebody gives me better reasons than what I am afraid is just .. ranting.
ahartmetz49 minutes ago
[-] Chomsky makes the same point in his book "Manufacturing Consent": Economic papers report more truthfully than most because the truth is what their readers need to make decisions in the real world.
I find that pretty convincing and I do check out such papers occasionally for that reason.
The tricky thing about predictions made by public entity or persona is that, the fact that they are making public predictions creates a major influence on the outcome itself. People react to predictions made by them.
reply▲The thing with the Economist is that they have a style that’s like an erudite version of the old Time magazine — that is stories written to say what the editors want. Except the economist is way more dogmatic.
I used to read it regularly. I can’t imagine anyone looking to them for predictions, as even a casual reader could probably outline the magazine’s views on most any topic. Let me skim 4-5 recent issues, and I could probably replicate anything they would predict with like 85% accuracy!
I will say that my favorite part of the magazine was the wacky ads for big shots working for African countries, various UN things, NGOs, etc.
Joker_vD58 minutes ago
[-] Yep. That's why predicting the future of a system you're a part of is sometimes literally impossible; it boils, fundamentally, to the fact that logical negation doesn't have a fixed point.
reply▲CGMthrowaway1 hour ago
[-] A major reason why the new Fed chair is refusing to provide forward guidance, in a major departure from all(?) previous Fed chairs and will likely require textbooks to be rewritten.
reply▲Yes, one can see it this way, therefore they don’t want to provide forward guidance. One can also see it another way that ‘their job’ is to purposely use forward guidance to impact direction. Not sure which is the right way.
reply▲imo, its purpose is to be independent, because raising rates (combating inflation) is unpopular. otherwise, its job is pretty simple, it does't take much expertise, gravitas or technology to choose the number or to say no to the president.
reply▲Alan Greenspan (fed chair from 1987-2006) was famous for deliberately confusing forward guidance. Ben Bernanke and Janet Yellen are the historical anomalies for clearly communicating their intent.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fedspeak
Quote from Greenspan himself:
> As Fed chairman, every time I expressed a view, I added or subtracted 10 basis points from the credit market. That was not helpful. But I nonetheless had to testify before Congress. On questions that were too market-sensitive to answer, 'no comment' was indeed an answer. And so you construct what we used to call Fed-speak. I would hypothetically think of a little plate in front of my eyes, which was the Washington Post, the following morning's headline, and I would catch myself in the middle of a sentence. Then, instead of just stopping, I would continue on resolving the sentence in some obscure way which made it incomprehensible. But nobody was quite sure I wasn't saying something profound when I wasn't. And that became the so-called Fed-speak which I became an expert on over the years. It's a self-protection mechanism ... when you're in an environment where people are shooting questions at you, and you've got to be very careful about the nuances of what you're going to say and what you don't say.
mrandish56 minutes ago
[-] I think the better Greenspan quote is from one of his earlier congressional testimony sessions: "Since becoming a central banker, I have learned to mumble with great incoherence. If I seem unduly clear to you, you must have misunderstood what I said."
reply▲No, only since Bernanke. So it’s very recent and not something that was historically done by Fed chairs.
reply▲The Fed is tasked with keeping inflation down and employment up. But they only have one knob.
reply▲VladVladikoff1 hour ago
[-] Strange to eschew the only actual power they have. Interesting times.
reply▲I don’t think The Economist has that kind of power. More likely that when they make covers like these every normie feels that way and it’s going the other way soon, as it has exhausted every buyer or seller and it has reached the ends of your earth and your Mom and Dad even feel that way.
https://www.readtrung.com/p/the-economist-cover-curse-explai...
It does not by itself but it is often just siding with a narrative that lot of other media houses and political parties are supporting as well.
reply▲CursedSilicon1 hour ago
[-] Sorry, but
...Normie?
What does that even mean in this context
Someone without a deeper understanding of markets who is just reacting superficially to news, headlines, mainstream information etc.
reply▲givemeethekeys18 minutes ago
[-] They don't have any real skin in the game.
Who cares if they're right about something? Are they putting money on the line? What is their P/L for being "right"?
In theory, their reputation which is the basis for maintaining their subscriber base and hence $$$
reply▲> Betteridge's law of headlines is an adage that states: "Any headline that ends in a question mark can be answered by the word no." It is based on the assumption that if the publishers were confident that the answer was yes, they would have presented it as an assertion; by presenting it as a question, they are not accountable for whether it is correct or not.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betteridge%27s_law_of_headline...
Which makes the headline quite clever in this case, since people will assume that means they aren't wrong, when in fact it means they aren't _always_ wrong.
reply▲aeternum28 minutes ago
[-] Not sure it's so clever because I completed it as "not always wrong but often wrong", which their graph in the article seems to confirm.
Mainstream predictions are easy, usually it means predicting status-quo. It's the out-of-consensus that matters (right 2 quadrants) and it looks like they are slightly worse than 50/50 on those.
Props for publishing it though.
https://medium.com/luminasticity/does-betteridges-law-still-...It seems it may also be used for really embarrassing things that will make powerful people mad if you just state them outright so it is necessary to state it as a question when you know the answer is yes.
Of course any yes or no question can be answered "no" but Betteridge, as we know, means a factually correct answer, and so there are these edge cases where the question mark is used for slightly different reasons than the law assumes and can be answered "yes".
reply▲I think the question was wrong. The problem is that the important things are wrong and the trivial things are right, which causes confusion.
reply▲Here is a mirror of the article without a paywall.
https://archive.is/FziAy
The Economist is partly owned by the Rothschild dynasty and was chaired by Evelyn de Rothschild for 17 years, so I've always just assumed it is going to tell you whatever would favor the global elite banking class.
The Economist has this to say about their ownership structure and editorial independence:
The Economist is part of The Economist Group, a private company with a special ownership structure designed to preserve editorial independence. Its shareholders date back more than a century, and include great names in British business, such as the Sainsburys, Cadburys and Schroders. Other shareholders today include funds owned by the Agnelli and Rothschild families. Many staff of The Economist Group also own shares, which are privately traded twice a year.
The company’s constitution does not permit any individual or group to gain a majority shareholding, and no shareholder can exercise more than 20% of voting rights. The editor is appointed by trustees, who are independent of commercial, political and proprietorial influences. This structure ensures that The Economist can take an independent view of the world—free to challenge conventional thinking and concentrations of power. Its role is to inform, not to serve vested interests.
https://myaccount.economist.com/s/article/Who-owns-The-Econo...
protocolture15 minutes ago
[-] No sorry you got this all wrong.
You were meant to ingest the word "Rothschild" and then immediately cease all thought and begin your 60 seconds of hate.
there should be some law where publications have to track their brier scores
reply▲I’d be surprised if they knew what a brier score was
reply▲Simpledempkin17 minutes ago
[-] Bernie's mittens of Fire can roundturn to Biden as dab-brushes, the economist can arrange for a formal hearing for Iowa caucuses as letters to Lagrange as first claim.
reply▲Wow. “We asked the wrong question and used the wrong tool to get a questionable answer, and then decided to publish it.” I guess the answer is yes?
reply▲We will never know as the article is behind a paywall:)
reply▲Betteridge's law of headlines :)
reply▲Please don't put anything with the paywall here.
reply▲left-struck2 hours ago
[-] Sorry, who are you exactly to give people orders?
reply▲"lalitium" -- it says so, right above the text.
reply▲If please helps, happy to add it. In fact I added it.
When you see the title, you are excited to read, then you're hit with a paywall. Such a bummer.
Yes, because they lie all the time.
reply▲They aren't great on transgender topics I hear
reply▲I don’t know what person reads The Economist to learn about trans topics (whatever you mean by that)
reply▲After subscribing for 15 years or so, I noped out after their "walker" cover. The world has enough "both sides" journalism, and I had thought them somewhat immune from that.
reply▲yeah imagine thinking biden was too old and infirm
reply▲What is “both sides” about that article?
reply▲Just because Fox News crowed about it doesn’t mean it’s bad journalism. Arguably toeing the party line is what resulted in Democrats being in that situation (fielding a weaker candidate against Trump) in the first place.
reply▲Framing someone who supports democracy vs someone who tried to overturn a free and fair election as a 'weaker' candidate is kind of the problem though. In any sane world, you'd support a literal corpse over a guy who does not want there to be free and fair elections.
reply▲You’ll find no disagreement from me that January 6th should, at the very least, have resulted in a ban from serving in public office, but we don’t live there. Which corpse would you rather have, one rank with Biden admin inflation/immigration concerns, or perhaps a bit fresher one?
reply▲akoboldfrying1 hour ago
[-] For me personally, seeing the phrase "both sides" used pejoratively is a red flag telling me I don't need to read any further.
When people disagree about something, hearing from both sides is important. Can this ideal of openmindedness be cynically abused by strawmanning one side while steelmanning the other? Yes, but in that case the appropriate response is to criticise the specific ways that one or both sides were misrepresented -- which is also the appropriate response to a piece that only presents one side, and does it badly. Muttering about "both sides" never adds anything to an argument. All it does is signal a deep commitment to remaining entrenched in your current position.
The problem is the assumption that in most debates there are sides to be taken, and that there are 2 of them. It leads to shoddy journalism where "balance" means finding someone to debate another, regardless of the bizarreness of their position.
In the real world there are many perspectives on a given issue, and a lot to be learned by everyone through open discussion. "Both sides" mentality discourages this, and also tends to give too much airtime to extreme views.
This explains the problem with it:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_balance
It's fine if you're talking about something where there are a broad spectrum of fairly reasonable policy positions. It's not fine when you have a TV segment that's like "here's Christina, an astrophysicist from Stanford, explaining how we measure the circumference of the earth, and up next we'll have Bob from the flat earth society"
next_xibalba2 hours ago
[-] Wait, what? People were offended by that? It seemed an apt cover in light of the situation.
For those unaware, the economist ran this [1] image after Biden’s historically disastrous debate in ‘24 (as a result of Biden’s age based senility being on full display after months of party and media complicity).
[1] https://www.economist.com/leaders/2024/07/04/why-biden-must-...
I missed that as my subscription ran out in 2017. Hilarious. Would have framed that cover.
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